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| Transit and Infrastructure All things T or civilly engineered within Boston Metro. |
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#1 | |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Approaching a City
Posts: 5,658
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Quote:
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#2 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Cambridge, MA/Charlottesville, VA
Posts: 332
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I say tear it down and invite Calatrava over to build us another showpiece bridge!
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#3 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Orient Heights
Posts: 3,133
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And run the Orange Line across it through Chelsea, Revere and Saugus.
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#4 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 935
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I'm praying that you were being sarcastic when you called the Zakim bridge a "showpiece".
"It will be world-renowned", "It will be like our own Golden Gate Bridge", etc., etc., etc. Um, yeah. It's a bridge. Sometimes, it lights up. That's about it. |
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#5 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Cambridge, MA/Charlottesville, VA
Posts: 332
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I see the characteristic Bostonian pessimism has struck you Jimbo. Actually, I wasn't being sarcastic at all. The Zakim is Boston's showpiece bridge, crowning the Big Dig and having found its way onto countless postcards, t-shirts, and those little background shots for TV interviewees based in Boston. Just because it's not internationally recognized doesn't mean it can't be a showpiece bridge. It's instantly become part of the cityscape, for just being "a bridge"?
This is "a bridge": |
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#6 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chelsea
Posts: 328
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Is it impossible to go under the Mystic River? Trains and lanes
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#7 |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,587
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Not impossible but it would truly be a Big Dig 2, a sequel that many people are not too keen to see.
__________________
http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com | http://futurembta.com brivx: well, my philosophy is: as designers, we make a good theater, we dont direct the play |
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#8 |
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Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1
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The plus is, its not all city above (where the tunnel would be going). They could use one of the TBM's from the N-S Rail project, just divert it a bit on its way out.
I can dream, eh? |
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#9 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 483
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A long range plan for the Tobin Bridge that I'm thinking of would be to remove it and build a new one upstream. The existing route would be replaced with a low-level draw-bridge carrying light rail and local traffic.
This would remove the expressway and bridge away from the core of Chelsea, thus linking it with the rest of the city and waterfront to the west of the current bridge. My concept is this:
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#10 |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,587
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Good idea for the bridge but I don't think the T would like to have a draw bridge used for the Green Line. Plus, where would you have it connect to the subway? Lechmere?
__________________
http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com | http://futurembta.com brivx: well, my philosophy is: as designers, we make a good theater, we dont direct the play |
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#11 |
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Senior Member
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The Green Line el between Science Park and Lechmere used to have a drawbridge. (I think it's still there but no longer operable)
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#12 |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,587
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Exactly, this would be a draw bridge that would go up and down many times a day. I'm sure any competent transit agency could time their headways around this but I don't trust the T.
__________________
http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com | http://futurembta.com brivx: well, my philosophy is: as designers, we make a good theater, we dont direct the play |
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#13 |
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Senior Member
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And I think the old elevated Orange Line had drawbridges across both the Mystic and the Charles.
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#14 |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,587
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Yes but these were all BERy built bridges. The MBTA seems to prefer high level fixed bridges (Red Line over Neponset , Orange Line at Wellington) so I would assume they would want the same with any new bridge.
__________________
http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com | http://futurembta.com brivx: well, my philosophy is: as designers, we make a good theater, we dont direct the play |
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#15 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: North End
Posts: 1,281
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I don't have any numbers to back this up, but I'd imagine that the amount of water traffic going through a draw bridge in that spot, coupled with all of the traffic, would create a traffic nightmare. Look at the drawbridge in front of the MOS; it only goes up a few times a week, and every time it does, it snarls Leaveritt Circle for hours.
I think, if you tear down the old Tobin, it has to be replaced with a similar bridge (ugh as in ugly) or with a tunnel (ugh as in, not again!). |
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#16 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Chelsea
Posts: 328
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The tunnel shouldn't be as difficult as the dig. As CJ pointed out, it's not all city and nowhere does it interact with a downtown/financial district like in the proper. This would be a great benefit to both Chelsea and Charlestown as they are separated by a bridge that someone pointed out is actually longer than the Golden Gate.
Van wrote Quote:
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#17 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: North End
Posts: 1,281
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^ Another reason to be optimistic about a tunnel replacing the Tobin: it wouldn't need to be as long as the bridge currently is. The bridge is so long because it needs to be really high to keep the waterway beneath navigable. The depth of the tunnel, I'm guessing, would be much shallower than the bridge is high. That being said, I'd hate to be the person who walks into city hall and says, "guess what guys! We're building another tunnel!" Whether or not the job would be easier job than the Big Dig is one thing, but trying to convince everyone in the Commonwealth to under go the project is another. Although, the case could be made that building a tunnel for Route 1 would be way less intrusive than the CA/T; it's not like the bridge has many cross streets or streets running under it while it's over the water.
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#18 |
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Moderator
Join Date: May 2006
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,587
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Any tunnel from North Station to Charlestown would be really hard to pull off and expensive due to:
Orange Line tunnels Big Dig tunnels Zakim Bridge I-93 viaduct Route 1 tunnels to the Tobin Bridge The area is so crowded that the only affordable connection would have to be further north and bypass the Navy Yard.
__________________
http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com | http://futurembta.com brivx: well, my philosophy is: as designers, we make a good theater, we dont direct the play |
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#19 |
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 434
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Skip North Station: a subway line could go Chelsea> Bunker Hill Monument > Navy Yard> North End > State > P.O.Sq...> S.Station (really deep) >???
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#20 |
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Boston
Posts: 98
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Light Rail Line, Chelsea-->Charleston-->North End-->RK Greeway-->Summer St.-->South Boston Bypass-->Dorchester
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