archBOSTON.org

Go Back   archBOSTON.org > Boston's Built Environment > Transit and Infrastructure

Transit and Infrastructure All things T or civilly engineered within Boston Metro.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-12-2017, 02:10 PM   #2981
dwash59
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Allston
Posts: 581
Re: Biking in Boston

As Hubway expands into more outlying neighborhoods,I think they should up the time from 30min to 45min. Even in the first few years, there were some point-to-point rides that were ~35 minutes, possibly 40 in traffic. For instance, Google has Alewife to the WTC in the seaport at 48 minutes biking. For some, that is part of their commute.
dwash59 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 02:33 PM   #2982
Arlington
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: West Medford, MA
Posts: 3,544
Re: Biking in Boston

It is really expensive to rebalance the Hubway system if it is used for whole commutes: Core stations overfill, edge stations empty, and the system can only originate or terminate exactly as many trips as it has bikes and docks.

Or bikes have to be man-handled out of the core as the morning rush-hour progresses and then need to be dragged back into the core in order to supply the evening Rush Hour. It ends up being a bike valet service which is very labor-intensive instead of a bike sharing service which operates on a self-service basis.

Extending the time limit for trips would only make this problem worse because it would really facilitate long one-way trips that are not easily balanced.

If you really want to commute by bike from Arlington to the Seaport either you should buy a personal bike ( and we should make sure that there is a safe weatherproof place to park it in the Seaport,) or you can use Hubway from Arlington Center to Alewife and from South Station to Seaport but take the Red Line in between.

What the system wants is for every trip from Arlington center to Alewife to be balanced buy an errand trip from Alewife back to Arlington center, or at least a commuting trip to Cambridge Park Drive.

And for every trip from South Station to the seaport be balanced by a lunch trip from the Seaport back to South Station. Hubway works best as a Frst Mile & Last Mile system but leaves the Long Middle trips to traditional rail or bus transit.
__________________
"Trying to solve congestion by making roadways wider is like trying to solve obesity by buying bigger pants."--Charles Marohn

Last edited by Arlington; 01-13-2017 at 07:45 AM.
Arlington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2017, 02:52 PM   #2983
Arlington
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: West Medford, MA
Posts: 3,544
Re: Biking in Boston

So, I saw my first zagster bike today at Canal Park (Lechmere), which also happens to be near their First St HQ (or co-HQ with San Francisco)

http://bike.zagster.com/riders/

Can anyone help me understand how/why Zagster & Hubway Exist side by side?

About 3 posts upthread, Zagster was named as a "not leading" option for the Town of Arlington.

Is zagster succeeding at the "workplace" scale even if it can't compete at the "town" scale?
__________________
"Trying to solve congestion by making roadways wider is like trying to solve obesity by buying bigger pants."--Charles Marohn
Arlington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2017, 06:46 PM   #2984
elemenoh
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 249
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arlington View Post
So, I saw my first zagster bike today at Canal Park (Lechmere), which also happens to be near their First St HQ (or co-HQ with San Francisco)

http://bike.zagster.com/riders/

Can anyone help me understand how/why Zagster & Hubway Exist side by side?

About 3 posts upthread, Zagster was named as a "not leading" option for the Town of Arlington.

Is zagster succeeding at the "workplace" scale even if it can't compete at the "town" scale?
I don't know if they're succeeding, but they certainly seem to have refocused on offering their bike share as an amenity for property managers, resorts, hotels, and campuses. It looks like a scheme that would work well for small self-contained systems.

While Hubway looks incredibly expensive on the surface, there's a big benefit for towns in the region to stick with that system and extend it out a bit beyond the urban core.

Zagster approached Provincetown a year or so ago about doing a bike share out here on Cape Cod, but that discussion didn't go anywhere.
elemenoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2017, 09:35 AM   #2985
Scipio
Senior Member
 
Scipio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 482
Re: Biking in Boston

If a property manager within a traditional bike share service area is setting up a service like Zagster, they're targeting the out-and-back users running errands or going for a recreational ride. I think the capital costs are cheaper than paying for Hubway to set up a dock and bikes.

Speaking of Hubway competition, I wonder if any of the dockless Chinese bike sharing start ups decide to start serving Boston. Bluegogo is starting service in San Francisco this year and will probably be the first of its kind in America. In China the companies can make a profit off a bike if it can survive for only three months out on the street, and costs for the users is something like a dime per trip.
Scipio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2017, 08:56 AM   #2986
Scipio
Senior Member
 
Scipio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 482
Re: Biking in Boston

Brookline ruled out having any bike lane treatments on Babcock Street after two years of meetings. The design alternatives over the years included everything from basic painted bike lane to Danish-style separated bike lanes in each direction to a total reimagining of the street that made it one-way for cars and installed a two-way bike lane. After all of those were shot down by neighbors the city went back and looked at even more options, including routing people on bikes off Babcock and onto local side streets.

In the end they picked Option 4, sharrows and raised crosswalks, after a difficult meeting:

Quote:
Removing parking for bike lanes had been removed previously from the options because of the large turn-out at previous meetings of people opposed to removal of car parking. We were fortunate to have several excellent pro-bike people speaking including Anne Lusk who lives in Brookline.

I was disgusted at the eye rolling and whispering and head shaking by people seated near me at anything that had to do with bikes.They even did that with Anne Lusk who was speaking about her efforts of bringing cycling to elderly communities and her research that biking is a much better exercise for the brain than walking to prevent Alzheimer's. No one is more articulate than Anne Lusk, a renowned researcher.
Scipio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2017, 09:28 AM   #2987
Arlington
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: West Medford, MA
Posts: 3,544
Re: Biking in Boston

^Sad but understandable. It will take another generation of bad traffic before people prefer non-car to car.

Meanwhile, is there any chance of getting more bike facilities to along and from the D branch in Brookline?

I know it is impossible on many stretches along, but are there any possibles left?

And how about to/from?
__________________
"Trying to solve congestion by making roadways wider is like trying to solve obesity by buying bigger pants."--Charles Marohn
Arlington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-24-2017, 02:42 PM   #2988
cden4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,064
Re: Biking in Boston

The fact that Brookline, a city where every resident who has a car MUST have an off-street parking space, cannot even remove a few on-street spaces from one street in order to create bike lanes, is totally embarrassing and shows that the politicians' supposed commitment to bike safety is a total farce.
cden4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2017, 05:58 AM   #2989
FK4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,156
Re: Biking in Boston

^It is a town, not city. Representative government won - the people on Babcock don't want it.

And this is ok. It's not some huge, lamentable tragedy. Babcock is a pretty safe street already and I've never felt it's a priority road for bike infrastructure. It's also not the most critical of urban connections... If the state can force a crossing thru beacon yards, that will change, of course. When they finally repave it, it will increase the speeds, potentially, but I'm glad they're going to put in crosswalks. Yes, it would be nice if bike projects sailed thru every time, but this one wasn't top priority by any means, in my opinion.
FK4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2017, 06:51 PM   #2990
Arlington
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: West Medford, MA
Posts: 3,544
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by autonomy View Post
This was a surprising find - Christian Herter Park (across the Charles from Mount Auburn Cemetery)
It makes great sense for every DCR parking lot whernever:
- there's no obvious transit nearby
- there's good bike infrastructure nearby
- it is within biking distance of "bikey" employers (Boston & Cambridge)

There's one at Dilboy Field which is only marginally walkable to the 80/94 Buses on Boston Ave and is far from the 87/88 Busses on Broadway, but has a new paved path along the Alewife Brook Parkway.

I don't see it being well used (OK, I've never seen a bike rack more than 1 car parked there) but at the cost of only a few signs it is a worthy experiment.
__________________
"Trying to solve congestion by making roadways wider is like trying to solve obesity by buying bigger pants."--Charles Marohn
Arlington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2017, 09:36 PM   #2991
chmeeee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: JP
Posts: 252
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arlington View Post
It makes great sense for every DCR parking lot whernever:
- there's no obvious transit nearby
- there's good bike infrastructure nearby
- it is within biking distance of "bikey" employers (Boston & Cambridge)

There's one at Dilboy Field which is only marginally walkable to the 80/94 Buses on Boston Ave and is far from the 87/88 Busses on Broadway, but has a new paved path along the Alewife Brook Parkway.

I don't see it being well used (OK, I've never seen a bike rack more than 1 car parked there) but at the cost of only a few signs it is a worthy experiment.
Map of locations: http://www.parkandpedalmap.org/#/map/
chmeeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-26-2017, 03:35 PM   #2992
autonomy
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 42
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by chmeeee View Post
Hey! What happened to my original post?

That's a cool map, I really had no idea. They could use more parking on the Minuteman.
autonomy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2017, 11:06 AM   #2993
Scipio
Senior Member
 
Scipio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 482
Re: Biking in Boston

The Boston Cyclists Union has a write-up of the four options for Inman Square:

http://bostoncyclistsunion.org/uncat...-inman-square/









I think that "Bend Cambridge" does the best job of giving today's cyclists a better trip through Inman. Most bike traffic is on Hampshire Street and that proposal gives them a simple and direct single-light trip through the square.

The Roundabout proposal is really intriguing though. It introduces more complexity for the Hampshire Street cyclists but probably does a better overall job of balancing bike traffic from other directions, and is definitely the best option for people walking.
Scipio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2017, 11:44 AM   #2994
fattony
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Davis/Ball Sq.
Posts: 1,827
Re: Biking in Boston

I think all of these are over complicating things.

I think the peanut with stop signs and without the bike lanes would be a great solution. Everyone stops before entering the peanut. Cars and bikes proceed through the peanut in a single lane with a posted speed limit of 15mph. Everyone in the peanut yields to pedestrians in the zebra crossing.

It is easy for anyone to understand even the first time they drive through it and it eliminates to ridiculous conflict of bikes crossing auto traffic without a signal as depicted in the peanut above. The only downsides to anyone are that bikes have to merge with autos, which I actually think is the safest thing in this case, and cars have to go as slow as a bicycle for about 500 feet. I think that is a pretty fair trade off in exchange for a simple, orderly intersection.
fattony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2017, 03:13 PM   #2995
sm89
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Somerville
Posts: 802
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by fattony View Post
I think all of these are over complicating things.

I think the peanut with stop signs and without the bike lanes would be a great solution. Everyone stops before entering the peanut. Cars and bikes proceed through the peanut in a single lane with a posted speed limit of 15mph. Everyone in the peanut yields to pedestrians in the zebra crossing.

It is easy for anyone to understand even the first time they drive through it and it eliminates to ridiculous conflict of bikes crossing auto traffic without a signal as depicted in the peanut above. The only downsides to anyone are that bikes have to merge with autos, which I actually think is the safest thing in this case, and cars have to go as slow as a bicycle for about 500 feet. I think that is a pretty fair trade off in exchange for a simple, orderly intersection.
If you're going to spend a good chunk of money on improvements, then full separation is preferred. Even with cars traveling slowly, parents and their children won't feel safe biking through in a shared lane. That's the main goal here: safety for everyone.
sm89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2017, 08:43 AM   #2996
FK4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,156
Re: Biking in Boston

The peanut really is a great place making device, especially if they do a good job on the parklet in the middle. Inman right now is ill defined as a square. I'd be for this one, even though it would probably make a traffic disaster here.
FK4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2017, 08:59 AM   #2997
datadyne007
Senior Member
 
datadyne007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Everett, MA
Posts: 8,648
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by FK4 View Post
The peanut really is a great place making device, especially if they do a good job on the parklet in the middle. Inman right now is ill defined as a square. I'd be for this one, even though it would probably make a traffic disaster here.
The middle island is not designed to be accessible, so I'd hesitate calling it a parklet. Note the lack of crosswalks to it. The red brick you see is an apron for large trucks to ride on to make the turns that normal cars can do on the regular road only. Regardless, I agree overall that the peanut gives Inman a sense of place that it currently lacks due to the wide expanses of pavement.
__________________
Commuter Rail. Reimagined. Read the report: regionalrail.net
Electrification + High Platforms + Infrastructure + Frequent Service + Free Transfers = #REGIONALRAIL
datadyne007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2017, 11:35 AM   #2998
fattony
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Davis/Ball Sq.
Posts: 1,827
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by sm89 View Post
If you're going to spend a good chunk of money on improvements, then full separation is preferred. Even with cars traveling slowly, parents and their children won't feel safe biking through in a shared lane. That's the main goal here: safety for everyone.
I know I keep harping on this, but the peanut, as proposed, doesn't look safe for how commuting cyclists and automobiles will use it, which accounts for about 99.9% of the people using it. I'm not sure we need too much weight placed on the feelings of children when designing this intersection for safety. Anyone who feels unsafe riding in traffic is always welcome to walk their bike on the sidewalk and in pedestrian crossings. The vast majority of people on this bike corridor are experienced urban cyclists.

Green paint on the right side of the road doesn't make it safer than riding single-file with traffic. Follow the green path around the peanut. At every exit street there is a conflict between a car exiting and a bike proceeding by making a sharp left turn. All it takes is one car who doesn't signal before exiting to cream a cyclist who thought they were safe to proceed. Or one cyclist to not crane their neck all the way around to see a car approaching behind them with their signal on.

Sometimes people get dogmatic about separation=safety. It isn't always that simple. By having a green paint for bikes along the edge, they have essentially created a 2-lane rotary with all the problems that come with that. It is simply unnecessary for this intersection and degrades safety.

In Dutch roundabouts you'll see completely separated bike paths that cross exit roads at 90 angles with enough space for significant sightlines between the cars and the bike path crossing. This peanut isn't like that at all.
fattony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2017, 12:43 PM   #2999
JeffDowntown
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: South Cove
Posts: 2,730
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by fattony View Post
I know I keep harping on this, but the peanut, as proposed, doesn't look safe for how commuting cyclists and automobiles will use it, which accounts for about 99.9% of the people using it. I'm not sure we need too much weight placed on the feelings of children when designing this intersection for safety. Anyone who feels unsafe riding in traffic is always welcome to walk their bike on the sidewalk and in pedestrian crossings. The vast majority of people on this bike corridor are experienced urban cyclists.

Green paint on the right side of the road doesn't make it safer than riding single-file with traffic. Follow the green path around the peanut. At every exit street there is a conflict between a car exiting and a bike proceeding by making a sharp left turn. All it takes is one car who doesn't signal before exiting to cream a cyclist who thought they were safe to proceed. Or one cyclist to not crane their neck all the way around to see a car approaching behind them with their signal on.

Sometimes people get dogmatic about separation=safety. It isn't always that simple. By having a green paint for bikes along the edge, they have essentially created a 2-lane rotary with all the problems that come with that. It is simply unnecessary for this intersection and degrades safety.

In Dutch roundabouts you'll see completely separated bike paths that cross exit roads at 90 angles with enough space for significant sightlines between the cars and the bike path crossing. This peanut isn't like that at all.
+1 "Fully Separated" except for 11 critical car entrance and exit points in the inner car rotary.
__________________
Jeff H.
Downtown, South Cove
JeffDowntown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2017, 03:43 PM   #3000
sm89
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Somerville
Posts: 802
Re: Biking in Boston

Quote:
Originally Posted by fattony View Post
I know I keep harping on this, but the peanut, as proposed, doesn't look safe for how commuting cyclists and automobiles will use it, which accounts for about 99.9% of the people using it. I'm not sure we need too much weight placed on the feelings of children when designing this intersection for safety. Anyone who feels unsafe riding in traffic is always welcome to walk their bike on the sidewalk and in pedestrian crossings. The vast majority of people on this bike corridor are experienced urban cyclists.

Green paint on the right side of the road doesn't make it safer than riding single-file with traffic. Follow the green path around the peanut. At every exit street there is a conflict between a car exiting and a bike proceeding by making a sharp left turn. All it takes is one car who doesn't signal before exiting to cream a cyclist who thought they were safe to proceed. Or one cyclist to not crane their neck all the way around to see a car approaching behind them with their signal on.
I wasn't saying that the peanut was the right option. My point was that any shared facilities should be out of the question if it's a large-scale reconstruction like this. I am aware that experienced cyclists are the majority, but that's only because they're the only ones who feel comfortable riding through in the current facilities (door zone bike lanes and sharrows).
sm89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Biking in Boston vanshnookenraggen Transit and Infrastructure 3 08-08-2008 12:24 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.