Seaport Neighborhood - Infill and Discussion

[shmessy]

Originally Posted by odurandina

Globe feature (cue the before & after sliders)

.......

Cool stuff, but just to be clear, it's marketing:

"This content was produced by Boston Globe Media's BG BrandLab in collaboration with the advertiser. The news and editorial departments of The Boston Globe had no role in its production or display."

[BeeLine]

[DZH22]

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IMG_8707 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8709 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8714 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8718 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8740 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8762 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8791 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8811 by David Z, on Flickr

IMG_8814 by David Z, on Flickr

[FK4]

I took a drive down Congress starting at Martha Road/Lomasney - it's a great road in that it's really the only one that you can take all the way across the city without any turning. But down the Seaport, I was pretty amazed at the amount of construction. I've felt that way before but it this current wave is pretty impressive.

I also don't remember the Boston Design and Innovation Center replacing all the beautiful old industrial windows. They look great.

[vanshnookenraggen]

They should rename this Menimo Drive just so we all know who fucked Boston for a generation or two.

[Equilibria]

Originally Posted by vanshnookenraggen

They should rename this Menimo Drive just so we all know who fucked Boston for a generation or two.

I know! He took a decrepit railyard and opened it up to developers, who built on literally all of it, creating a new neighborhood that's a center of entertainment and dining, with buildings designed by world-famous architects built right up to an FAA-imposed height limit!

OH THE HORROR!

[cca]

That is all true ... accept it should have all been better. Lets not settle just because "something" finally happened. Its still pretty bad urban-ism at its core.

cca

[TheRifleman]

Originally Posted by Equilibria

I know! He took a decrepit railyard and opened it up to developers, who built on literally all of it, creating a new neighborhood that's a center of entertainment and dining, with buildings designed by world-famous architects built right up to an FAA-imposed height limit!

OH THE HORROR!

Hundreds of billions in tax dollars were diverted here only to benefit very rich corporations, Upper class international groups, very rich elite along with political coffers.
No appropriate transit was built for the public to enjoy a park or the waterfront. The Massachusetts taxpayers got hoodwinked and all they did was drive up our overall Living expenses.

TRANSIT is the bloodline needed to flow through a city to make it very accessible without creating Transit nightmare.
Parking in the city now is a minimum of $50. Parking tickets are now $50

Menino overall legacy in my opinion. A very corrupt fool

[FK4]

Originally Posted by TheRifleman

Hundreds of billions in tax dollars were diverted here only to benefit very rich corporations, Upper class international groups, very rich elite along with political coffers.
No appropriate transit was built for the public to enjoy a park or the waterfront. The Massachusetts taxpayers got hoodwinked and all they did was drive up our overall Living expenses.

TRANSIT is the bloodline needed to flow through a city to make it very accessible without creating Transit nightmare.

I actually agree with him. The tax breaks are disgusting, considering who has actually benefited. That being said, I think it’s unlikely the design would have been much better. The PWC building and the one next to it that both have the huge low slung footprints are the biggest losers in my opinion but the rest are fine. Yes, the plots should’ve been smaller and we should have gotten more streets. Transit should have been better. There should have been more public amenities and coordination of greenspace corridors. But given how bland and thoughtless Boston actually really is (despite the Globe’s and everyone else’s accolades on ourselves, we are), I think this is about as good as what one could have expected given the forces at play. We haven’t had a really smart mayor for decades, Menino was a small-minded buffoon and so is Marty. If you want world class design, elect a world class mayor.

[JANAM]

Originally Posted by FK4

I actually agree with him. The tax breaks are disgusting, considering who has actually benefited. That being said, I think it’s unlikely the design would have been much better. The PWC building and the one next to it that both have the huge low slung footprints are the biggest losers in my opinion but the rest are fine. Yes, the plots should’ve been smaller and we should have gotten more streets. Transit should have been better. There should have been more public amenities and coordination of greenspace corridors. But given how bland and thoughtless Boston actually really is (despite the Globe’s and everyone else’s accolades on ourselves, we are), I think this is about as good as what one could have expected given the forces at play. We haven’t had a really smart mayor for decades, Menino was a small-minded buffoon and so is Marty. If you want world class design, elect a world class mayor.

I agree about the transit, that's more of a State issue than a Mayoral decision. World class design costs money, with the cost of construction in Boston (union controlled) it makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to finance. It's not as easy as saying elect a world class Mayor.

[CSTH]

Well...at least its not a MegaPlex....

[sidewalks]

While I agree the Seaport is not what it could have been, and the architecture is generally not world class, it is becoming a truly vibrant part of the city with real street life and interesting urban spaces. In comparison to what I feared it would become, I am thrilled.

[FitchburgLine]

Originally Posted by sidewalks

While I agree the Seaport is not what it could have been, and the architecture is generally not world class, it is becoming a truly vibrant part of the city with real street life and interesting urban spaces. In comparison to what I feared it would become, I am thrilled.

Sidewalk activity levels are already noticeably better, and that's despite lots of parking lots left to fill. Plus, there are ~2000 housing units and >1k hotel rooms under construction right now.

[FK4]

Originally Posted by JANAM

I agree about the transit, that's more of a State issue than a Mayoral decision. World class design costs money, with the cost of construction in Boston (union controlled) it makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to finance. It's not as easy as saying elect a world class Mayor.

To qualify my diatribe a little more, I actually genuinely enjoy the Seaport... I also loved Canary Wharf and Paternoster Square, tho. There is something that I like about juxtaposing shiny and fairly banal newness against a very old city that is refreshing. I would never want to live here, but I always make a point of including it in my bike route. And, as Fitchburgline pointed out, it's proven to be very popular.

And yes, it's more than just the mayor... there are systems in place, and the system here is not one that allows for world class thinking. Boston is clannish and provincial, and so is the state. It is a place that automatically orients toward the minutia rather than figuring out what systemwide changes would make the most sense. Hence, for example, a single NIMBY in Brighton can sink the entire Circle Theater project.

[Suffolk 83]

Originally Posted by TheRifleman

Hundreds of billions in tax dollars were diverted here only to benefit very rich corporations, Upper class international groups, very rich elite along with political coffers.

This isn't true. BILLIONS? You might want to check the numbers. Vertex and GE got tax breaks that were low tens of millions of dollars.... I agree they shouldnt get anything but let's try to stick to facts.

You can't throw the big dig in here (only several billion, not hundreds) that's not fair.

[CSTH]

Agree its not 100s of Bs....but Big Dig was absolutely a prerequisite for developing the Seaport...

[jl326]

Originally Posted by Suffolk 83

This isn't true. BILLIONS? You might want to check the numbers. Vertex and GE got tax breaks that were low tens of millions of dollars.... I agree they shouldnt get anything but let's try to stick to facts.

You can't throw the big dig in here (only several billion, not hundreds) that's not fair.

Facts, accurate math, and reality often elude him. This is not a surprise.

I've also previously mentioned this, but for Vertex, the tax break was contingent upon reaching a defined and significant hiring goal by a due date (i.e., improving local employment which, last I checked, is not a bad thing). They ultimately fell short of that goal and they had to pay back either a proportional or substantial amount (don't recall).

Originally Posted by CSTH

Agree its not 100s of Bs....but Big Dig was absolutely a prerequisite for developing the Seaport...

I don't see the logic in that line of thinking. Public money also filled in the Back Bay. I'm not knocking on the door of some mansion on Beacon St. and telling the person living there that he owes me anything.

[TheRifleman]

Originally Posted by jl326

Facts, accurate math, and reality often elude him. This is not a surprise.

I've also previously mentioned this, but for Vertex, the tax break was contingent upon reaching a defined and significant hiring goal by a due date (i.e., improving local employment which, last I checked, is not a bad thing). They ultimately fell short of that goal and they had to pay back either a proportional or substantial amount (don't recall).




I don't see the logic in that line of thinking. Public money also filled in the Back Bay. I'm not knocking on the door of some mansion on Beacon St. and telling the person living there that he owes me anything.

Take a look at the surrounding areas in Boston real estate tax rates in the overall area the last 3 years.
This is a basic 2 family property tax rate soaring over 4 years.
Property Taxes Tax Assessment
2018 $7,418 +6.7% $724,400 +10.1%
2017 $6,950 +10.9% $658,100 +17.5%
2016 $6,265 +6.5% $559,900 +11.4%
2015 $5,882 +7.4% $502,700 +12.4%

These numbers are sick. How can the elderly even stay in their houses on fixed income? Even single families are shooting up in taxes.


Keep giving those corporations millions of tax breaks and allow them to build on billions of tax dollars that the tax payer paid for infrastructure on prime property. YOU GOT HOOD WINKED.

Concerning the VERTEX DEAL it wasn't vertex that got the deal. It lowered construction costs for FALLON the developer. WAKE UP.

[CSTH]

Originally Posted by jl326

I don't see the logic in that line of thinking. Public money also filled in the Back Bay. I'm not knocking on the door of some mansion on Beacon St. and telling the person living there that he owes me anything.

I don't think I was suggesting that anyone living in the seaport owes you anything.

But - keep in mind (to extend your comparison) that the zoning in the backbay was very prescriptive, down to the acceptable dimensions of bay windows, with the intention of creating a coherent and attractive built environment. And there was also a lot of land / space / money dedicated to public spaces and institutions.

[TheRifleman]

Originally Posted by CSTH

I don't think I was suggesting that anyone living in the seaport owes you anything.

But - keep in mind (to extend your comparison) that the zoning in the backbay was very prescriptive, down to the acceptable dimensions of bay windows, with the intention of creating a coherent and attractive built environment. And there was also a lot of land / space / money dedicated to public spaces and institutions.

The overall public taxpayer was not in the hole for the backbay infrastructure for Billions of tax dollars like the Seaport.

Patrick and Menino did give Liberty Mutual almost 50 Million in tax breaks to build the Liberty Mutual building claiming its all about jobs as the Backbay was hovering under 7% vacancy.

These politicans should be in JAIL now. This is nothing more than FRAUD.