Portland, ME - New Construction Continued

[Subdivisions]

took a visit to portland recently, nice little city y'all got there

[TC_zoid]

"Nice little city?"... you say, and then you put pics of railroad ties, SoPo tank farm, gritty dock and lobster traps. You forgot the scrapyards in Bayside.

[Cosakita18]

Thank you! We're quite proud of our little city!

On another note, the city wants to convert space on the Maine State Pier into a public seafood market as well as retail and startup space

http://www.pressherald.com/2017/11/2...ne-state-pier/

[Max]

Renderings of the proposed Brown Street parking garage, going before the Planning Board this evening. I hope the garage can be a catalyst for further development in the area because it's certainly not going to enliven the streetscape on Brown or Cumberland Streets.

[Cosakita18]

Some news from across the Fore River. Avesta released its first rendering of a 64 unit mixed-use project just off Western Ave. in SoPo



From the PPH article:

Avesta Housing submitted a much-anticipated proposal to city planners on Thursday for a 64-unit housing project that would be built in the city’s West End neighborhood and target mostly low-income families.

The five-story West End Apartments would be built at 586 Westbrook St., site of Le Variety and the West End Neighborhood Resource Hub, and would include ground-level commercial space to house both the convenience store and the social service agency, according to Avesta’s application.

http://www.pressherald.com/2017/11/3...ands-west-end/

[Max]

No renderings yet, but the developers behind Luminato Condos have begun promoting their next condo development, Verdante, which will be built on the site of the former Portland Co-op building at the corner of Hampshire and Federal Streets. I'm curious what height they're aiming for with this one -- they're advertising "soaring ceilings" and 3-bedroom condos -- which makes me think it will likely be as tall as Luminato.

http://verdantecondos.com/

[Cosakita18]

In reference to an earlier post / rumor that the redevelopment of 58 Fore St. was on hold until the Portland Pipeline lawsuit was settled

A Federal judge just ruled against SoPo in the city's motion to dismiss the suit. It looks like this lawsuit will be going on for at least another 2 years according to the PPH article.

Woodcock’s anticipated next step would be to rule on the merits of the company’s claim against the Clear Skies ordinance.

Whatever the outcome in U.S. District Court, the case is expected to wind up in the 1st U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Boston and take another two to three years to reach a conclusion.

“(The company) will not complete the reversal project for at least another three or four years,” Woodcock said. “Three or four years is a lifetime in the oil business.”

http://www.pressherald.com/2017/12/1...eline-lawsuit/


So the question is, how will this impact the 58 Fore St. / Portland Foreside redevelopment?

[TC_zoid]

I know for a fact that Jim Brady holding off on that development until he knows what's happening with the oil reversal scenario. Reason is simple. His condos are directly across, and who would pay up to 1.75 million for a condo (going rate for penthouse now with the one next to the new Marriot going up) when they could spend that for an incredible home anywhere else on the coast?

Originally Posted by Cosakita18

In reference to an earlier post / rumor that the redevelopment of 58 Fore St. was on hold until the Portland Pipeline lawsuit was settled

A Federal judge just ruled against SoPo in the city's motion to dismiss the suit. It looks like this lawsuit will be going on for at least another 2 years according to the PPH article.



http://www.pressherald.com/2017/12/1...eline-lawsuit/


So the question is, how will this impact the 58 Fore St. / Portland Foreside redevelopment?

[Cosakita18]

Originally Posted by TC_zoid

I know for a fact that Jim Brady holding off on that development until he knows what's happening with the oil reversal scenario. Reason is simple. His condos are directly across, and who would pay up to 1.75 million for a condo (going rate for penthouse now with the one next to the new Marriot going up) when they could spend that for an incredible home anywhere else on the coast?

Well as the article says, this lawsuit could be tied up for several years. Does that mean the entire Foreside Redevelopment is on hold?? Even the office and retail space??

It seems somewhat foolish to plan a major development around the outcome of a lawsuit in another city.

[TC_zoid]

Originally Posted by Cosakita18

Well as the article says, this lawsuit could be tied up for several years. Does that mean the entire Foreside Redevelopment is on hold?? Even the office and retail space??

It seems somewhat foolish to plan a major development around the outcome of a lawsuit in another city.

Perhaps not when investing a couple of hundred million dollars. The 3rd floor and higher condos for this project will have 3 oil tanker moorings directly blocking the view of Portland Headlight in the distance. You can see Portland Headlight from Eastern Prom, of course. These moorings would be quite active if this project goes through. Check out the line of sight on Google Maps. By the time this would finish, a Penthouse in Portland could be nearly 3 million (currently at 1.75 million) and you could buy a sweet house on the coast with that kind of coin.

[Cosakita18]

Originally Posted by TC_zoid

Perhaps not when investing a couple of hundred million dollars. The 3rd floor and higher condos for this project will have 3 oil tanker moorings directly blocking the view of Portland Headlight in the distance. You can see Portland Headlight from Eastern Prom, of course. These moorings would be quite active if this project goes through. Check out the line of sight on Google Maps. By the time this would finish, a Penthouse in Portland could be nearly 3 million (currently at 1.75 million) and you could buy a sweet house on the coast with that kind of coin.

Even if Portland Pipeline Co. loses this lawsuit, that tank farm near bug Light will clearly still be there for at least a decade.... The 58 Fore St. developers can't have gone through the entire master plan process with the expectation that those tanks would be torn down anytime soon... Or that the oil terminal near bug Light would never see another ship....And besides those tanks are really a minor blotch on the landscape, especially since you can turn your head 20 degrees and get a spectacular view across the harbor towards Peaks Island

[TC_zoid]

Originally Posted by Cosakita18

Even if Portland Pipeline Co. loses this lawsuit, that tank farm near bug Light will clearly still be there for at least a decade.... The 58 Fore St. developers can't have gone through the entire master plan process with the expectation that those tanks would be torn down anytime soon... Or that the oil terminal near bug Light would never see another ship....And besides those tanks are really a minor blotch on the landscape, especially since you can turn your head 20 degrees and get a spectacular view across the harbor towards Peaks Island

True, but the tanks don't spew smoke and leak oil into the harbor. And, you can paint them green the way some are near SoPo high school. Not sure why they haven't done that already?

[Max]

A brief overview of some proposed and under-construction office space in Portland in today's Press Herald: http://www.pressherald.com/2018/01/0...dings-planned/

The article confirms that the work on the Ocean Gateway Garage will add office space, which should be interesting. I guess that the office space will occupy the new bulge that will jut out of the garage towards Fore Street. I've seen the external rendering of this but I'm having trouble imagining habitable office space on the inside.

The article also says work is underway at the Widgery Wharf site, but I just drove by there the other day and didn't notice any construction.

Most interestingly a CBRE rep says that he expects at least one major employer to propose a downtown Portland relocation this year. Perhaps we will get a new office tower proposal after all!

[Cosakita18]

Originally Posted by Max

A brief overview of some proposed and under-construction office space in Portland in today's Press Herald: http://www.pressherald.com/2018/01/0...dings-planned/

The article confirms that the work on the Ocean Gateway Garage will add office space, which should be interesting. I guess that the office space will occupy the new bulge that will jut out of the garage towards Fore Street. I've seen the external rendering of this but I'm having trouble imagining habitable office space on the inside.

Likewise, My initial thought was that the renovations were purely cosmetic. I've heard a lot of negative things about that garage in the past

Originally Posted by Max

Most interestingly a CBRE rep says that he expects at least one major employer to propose a downtown Portland relocation this year. Perhaps we will get a new office tower proposal after all!

The article mentions pulling a big employer downtown from a suburb, but I'm struggling to imagine who that could be. Idexx and Tyler Tech are both committing themselves to the suburbs with expansions of their campuses, Unum has an excess of space at their campus by the Jetport. Maybe Hannaford would want a headquarters that isn't buried in an industrial park in Scarborough?

I would say that trying to lure a NEW major company to the Portland area would be far more beneficial than our current group of big employers shuffling between the suburbs and the peninsula. Maybe we'll get lucky with Amazon, eh?

[Dr. StrangeHat]

This is purely the rumor mill, so who knows if it's true or not - but I heard a rumor not too long ago that Unum put their original building on outer Congress Street (the one they call HO1) up for sale.

[cneal]

Could be L.L. Bean. They've long had having trouble recruiting and retaining creative workers with their suburban HQ in Freeport (it's not even in the village), although the new METRO Breez route might be helping them. Plus, their current HQ office building is pretty dingy.

Of course, locating headquarters offices is a lot different than relocating the entire business. I've heard that WEX is keeping a lot of back-office jobs in South Portland even after they move into their new building on the waterfront.

For similar reasons I find it hard to believe any big company is going to pay a premium for new offices on Thompson's Point. It's got many of the same issues with most suburban campuses – it's pretty isolated, with no place nearby to get coffee or even for a regular lunch and no good bike or pedestrian connections to the rest of the city. These companies relocating downtown are relying on significantly higher rates of walk/bike/transit commuting among their workers in order to offset parking costs, but that's gonna be a tall order on Thompson's Point.

[Cosakita18]

Originally Posted by cneal

For similar reasons I find it hard to believe any big company is going to pay a premium for new offices on Thompson's Point. It's got many of the same issues with most suburban campuses – it's pretty isolated, with no place nearby to get coffee or even for a regular lunch and no good bike or pedestrian connections to the rest of the city. These companies relocating downtown are relying on significantly higher rates of walk/bike/transit commuting among their workers in order to offset parking costs, but that's gonna be a tall order on Thompson's Point.

The renderings of the Thompson's point building don't exactly look spectacular. It looks like a very bland and uninspired suburban office building. It seems like it would be best used as medical office space.

I could see a big company being interested in the Portland Foreside offices, especially being so close to the water and new WEX hq. It's a very desireable location.

[portlandneedsnewarena]

Originally Posted by cneal

Could be L.L. Bean. They've long had having trouble recruiting and retaining creative workers with their suburban HQ in Freeport (it's not even in the village), although the new METRO Breez route might be helping them. Plus, their current HQ office building is pretty dingy.

Of course, locating headquarters offices is a lot different than relocating the entire business. I've heard that WEX is keeping a lot of back-office jobs in South Portland even after they move into their new building on the waterfront.

For similar reasons I find it hard to believe any big company is going to pay a premium for new offices on Thompson's Point. It's got many of the same issues with most suburban campuses – it's pretty isolated, with no place nearby to get coffee or even for a regular lunch and no good bike or pedestrian connections to the rest of the city. These companies relocating downtown are relying on significantly higher rates of walk/bike/transit commuting among their workers in order to offset parking costs, but that's gonna be a tall order on Thompson's Point.

I am told that LL Bean is going to be doing a major modernization/renovation of their HQ office in Freeport. It's in the final design phase right now and I believe it is suppose to start sometime in 2018. I am sure we will be reading about it in the coming months.

[TC_zoid]

Both the WEX and Idexx CEO's are on the record stating how hard it is to attract talent to Maine. I can't see a big problem attracting talent to work and live in Portland's peninsula, even with the lower salaries as compared to places in Boston -- especially for those under 40, as social activities and modern designed buildings important. Young people all over the world are leaving smaller towns for dynamic cities. When WEX and a few other buildings in that area are done, the East End will convey an exciting vibe. Did you know the Residence Inn by Marriott just spent over $2 million to renovate its lobby, restaurant, lounge and some of the rooms? They get it. They want to be the default place to stay for all those visiting WEX employees based in other countries. But Portland has to be even more aggressive getting companies to locate here. The companies will, if you give them the incentives.

[Cosakita18]

Originally Posted by TC_zoid

But Portland has to be even more aggressive getting companies to locate here. The companies will, if you give them the incentives.

Exactly this. It seems like there isn't a good cohesive regional or statewide incentive strategy for attracting large businesses. Portland has so many strengths, but I feel like we rely too much on the tourism trade.

Was chatting with a friend who works in the real estate business over lunch and he mentioned a "big new condo project along Cumberland Avenue" coming to the planning board within the next few months. Could this be the 16 story tower discussed earlier?