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Old 03-11-2011, 07:26 AM   #1
PaulC
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new HOV lane on 93

Last night's Harrison/Albany meeting had a presentation on the preliminary plans to add a second HOV lane on 93 from just after Savin Hill to around Southampton St. There will a gap between the new and old HOV sections. The space needed will come from the T tracks triggering the need for a tunnel for the Old Colony and allowing for a second track and from east side of 93 after that, i think they said this is already state or T property. It will also allow the existing lanes to be widened to the proper width. This is only the very first steps in a long process that will include all the needed alternative studies.

I expect there will be an article in th South End Patch today or tomorrow. I'm not a reporter so that might have a lot more information.
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Old 03-11-2011, 09:34 AM   #2
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

Fuck no!

Can someone elborate on the track/MBTA property thing? I'm confused.

But anyways, an existing lane should be taken for the HOV line. Screw cars! And royally screw cars with ONE occupant!
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Old 03-11-2011, 10:08 AM   #3
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

By Savin Hill the new lanes will be taken from the red line/old colony line area west of 93. This then forces a tunnel in that section. I'm not sure is that tunnel would include the red line but it will allow for a second and much needed second commuter rail track. Maybe f-line could elaborate on the red line/old colony problems in this area. The rest of the expansion will be from the east side of 93. I think one way or another the state owns all that land.

At this point this is only a proposal and far from a complete plan.

Does that answer your question?
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Old 03-11-2011, 11:20 AM   #4
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

Here in an article on last nights meeting, not about the HOV

http://southend.patch.com/articles/r...s-beneath-i-93

With it's massive debt the T should be forced to move the Albany St garage(across the street) here and sell the valuable property
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Old 03-11-2011, 11:49 AM   #5
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

The HOV lane on 93 is a joke. the stretch of 93 from downtown to the Braintree split needs a complete overhaul in a very bad way.

There should be a dedicated HOV lane with a full breakdown lane built into the expressway. You can do what they do in Chicago on the Kennedy, have the entrance gates for both directions and close off the ones going outbound during the morning and northbound in the evening.
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Old 03-11-2011, 12:04 PM   #6
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

I'd just get rid of the breakdown lanes entirely. They don't appear to be needed, since the experiment of using them as travel lanes during rush hour has been quite successful.
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Old 03-11-2011, 12:26 PM   #7
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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I'd just get rid of the breakdown lanes entirely. They don't appear to be needed, since the experiment of using them as travel lanes during rush hour has been quite successful.
93 from the Braintree split to downtown has almost no breakdown lanes, it's simply 4 lanes in each direction.

For a major stretch of important highway, 93 is very substandard.
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Old 03-11-2011, 01:53 PM   #8
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

Not sure how I feel about the idea but I'm damn certain that any tunnelling that needs to be done for the commuter rail better be paid for by MassDOT and not the T.
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Old 03-11-2011, 03:57 PM   #9
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

How in the hell are they gonna do that? The Old Colony's single-track, and is traffic-choked. It's an identified need that it needs to be double-tracked through that area, which itself is a multi-hundred million project requiring "lane-shift" of all 4 Red Line tracks and ripping up spanking-new Savin Hill station to carve out the room. Where the hell are they gonna find the additional land to expand 93 when it doesn't even have shoulders? They'd have to drop a $B to bury all 4 Red Line tracks to scrape up that much space for a lane that takes a raindrop's worth of traffic out of a flash flood.
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Old 03-11-2011, 06:22 PM   #10
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

I think the project starts north of the Savin Hill Ave, if that makes a difference
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Old 03-11-2011, 09:20 PM   #11
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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How in the hell are they gonna do that? The Old Colony's single-track, and is traffic-choked. It's an identified need that it needs to be double-tracked through that area, which itself is a multi-hundred million project requiring "lane-shift" of all 4 Red Line tracks and ripping up spanking-new Savin Hill station to carve out the room. Where the hell are they gonna find the additional land to expand 93 when it doesn't even have shoulders? They'd have to drop a $B to bury all 4 Red Line tracks to scrape up that much space for a lane that takes a raindrop's worth of traffic out of a flash flood.
From what I know of this spot, it's 2 tracks for Ashmont, Old Colony single, and 2 tracks for Braintree. The Old Colony would be burried... somewhere...? And then the 2 Red Line tracks would be shifted over (perhaps freeing up 1.5 or 2 track widths (spacing between rapid transit and commuter rail tracks seems to be a little generous). I'd like to know who gets shafted in order to make this tunnel though. Something's going to get buses here, I think.
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Old 03-11-2011, 09:59 PM   #12
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

I'm not sure how true this is, but I remember seeing some sort of report stating that it costs the city (aka us) over $1 million a year to open and close the HOV lane with that special vehicle. It would be WONDERFUL if we could finally get a real, dedicated HOV lane that only requires a small entrance and exit to be shifted.

Also, HOV lane usage shows disappointing figures:



Full article from 08/03/2009 - http://www.boston.com/news/local/mas...ncy_low_usage/
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Old 03-12-2011, 12:11 AM   #13
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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From what I know of this spot, it's 2 tracks for Ashmont, Old Colony single, and 2 tracks for Braintree. The Old Colony would be burried... somewhere...? And then the 2 Red Line tracks would be shifted over (perhaps freeing up 1.5 or 2 track widths (spacing between rapid transit and commuter rail tracks seems to be a little generous). I'd like to know who gets shafted in order to make this tunnel though. Something's going to get buses here, I think.
It'd probably have to be the other way around. New RR tunnel needs bigger clearances...space for high freights, future electrification, double-tracking. Basically anything remotely likely within a 75-year span between scheduled tunnel rehabs. And it would need diesel ventilation for this kind of running length. At that exploding cost it's going to be cheaper and easier-engineering to bury the Red Line where track layout and car dimensions are set in stone and no ventilation is required.

Now see if that plan flies once you tell commuters that the Red Line--which carries almost twice as many riders per day as the whole commuter rail system combined--will be subject to short-, medium-, and perhaps long-term bustitutions on each branch for 5 years while they do this. For HOV lanes that New Englanders are loathe to drive on, which do nothing to solve the biggest SE Expressway congestion points (Braintree split and no shoulder).

Plan: D.O.A.
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Old 03-12-2011, 01:29 AM   #14
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

If the two branches of the Red Line were merged just south of the Savin Hill Station, as shown on my plan here, then that would free up enough room for double tracking the Old Colony line, plus adding a reversible lane to the Expressway. Purple lines represent a double tracked old Colony Line, and the red lines are the Red Line tracks.




An existing unused freight spur underpass could be utilized for the junction of the two red Line branches. No tunneling would be needed. The Braintree Branch Red Line would bridge over the Old Colony double track line on a flyover. I think this would be buildable without having to shut down any of the lines during construction. There would have to be some temporary single tracking during construction, but no bustitution.

Last edited by Charlie_mta; 03-12-2011 at 01:41 AM.
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Old 03-12-2011, 01:37 AM   #15
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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I'm not sure how true this is, but I remember seeing some sort of report stating that it costs the city (aka us) over $1 million a year to open and close the HOV lane with that special vehicle.
Don't you mean the state? It's still a lot of money (paid by MA taxpayers) but when you consider the size of the state budget ($28 billion, give or take), $1 million is a drop in the proverbial bucket.
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Old 03-12-2011, 04:11 AM   #16
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

This sounds like a ridiculous waste of money. How about reducing traffic by making the T a viable alternative to driving? It says something that people choose to pay the high price of running a car and sitting in trafic jams on 93 over taking the T. And now they want to disrupted the commuter rail and red line while this stupid project drags on for years to add a HOV lane when they already know the current HOV lane is useless. Who the fuck thinks this is a good way to spend money? Who came up with this? I want to kick them in the nuts/vagina.
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Old 03-12-2011, 07:47 AM   #17
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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Who the fuck thinks this is a good way to spend money? Who came up with this? I want to kick them in the nuts/vagina.
That 4% of drivers who benefit.
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:06 AM   #18
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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Don't you mean the state? It's still a lot of money (paid by MA taxpayers) but when you consider the size of the state budget ($28 billion, give or take), $1 million is a drop in the proverbial bucket.
That's just opening and closing it. Repair costs for each aging vehicle are rising rapidly and have exceeded $1 mil per vehicle.
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:19 AM   #19
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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If the two branches of the Red Line were merged just south of the Savin Hill Station, as shown on my plan here, then that would free up enough room for double tracking the Old Colony line, plus adding a reversible lane to the Expressway. Purple lines represent a double tracked old Colony Line, and the red lines are the Red Line tracks.




An existing unused freight spur underpass could be utilized for the junction of the two red Line branches. No tunneling would be needed. The Braintree Branch Red Line would bridge over the Old Colony double track line on a flyover. I think this would be buildable without having to shut down any of the lines during construction. There would have to be some temporary single tracking during construction, but no bustitution.
Another way to give the Red Line an assist in that area to peel off road traffic is to open the mile-long yard lead track that splits off Columbia Junction at the start of the subway and runs to Cabot Yard. You could simply run revenue trains on that and around that yard, laying down about 1000 feet of new track to South Station on some of the vacated Post Office complex land that's slated for track expansion space. Put a platform there next to the Fairmount Line CR tracks so the two rapid-transit level services are next to each other and short-turn some northbound expresses at SS. Mainly Braintree line since that's where the highway park-and-riders are coming from. Could even stick a bare-bones outdoor platform at Broadway for an intermediate stop since the yard tracks run about a block away from the subway station. Frees up some subway capacity and allows you to really pack both southside branches full to subway-level headways at rush hour without congesting anything up. Tracks are all there except for the leg through the Post Office to South Station and join the mainline at the 4-track split so no pinch points. Yard traffic can use the tracks on the other side to get anywhere they need to go and avoid the thru traffic snaking around the right edge of the yard. Price tag: probably <$10 mil. because of all the existing full-speed rated trackage.
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Old 03-12-2011, 09:49 AM   #20
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Re: new HOV lane on 93

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Another way to give the Red Line an assist in that area to peel off road traffic is to open the mile-long yard lead track that splits off Columbia Junction at the start of the subway and runs to Cabot Yard. You could simply run revenue trains on that and around that yard, laying down about 1000 feet of new track to South Station on some of the vacated Post Office complex land that's slated for track expansion space. Put a platform there next to the Fairmount Line CR tracks so the two rapid-transit level services are next to each other and short-turn some northbound expresses at SS. Mainly Braintree line since that's where the highway park-and-riders are coming from. Could even stick a bare-bones outdoor platform at Broadway for an intermediate stop since the yard tracks run about a block away from the subway station. Frees up some subway capacity and allows you to really pack both southside branches full to subway-level headways at rush hour without congesting anything up. Tracks are all there except for the leg through the Post Office to South Station and join the mainline at the 4-track split so no pinch points. Yard traffic can use the tracks on the other side to get anywhere they need to go and avoid the thru traffic snaking around the right edge of the yard. Price tag: probably <$10 mil. because of all the existing full-speed rated trackage.
Probably useless without bigger parking garages in the Quincy area. Don't they already fill up pretty early? People still need to get to the trains.
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