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Old 02-22-2007, 08:31 AM   #1
grittys457
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Yesterday was a great day

The formula business ordinance in Portland was overturned and I got my first baby boy. Maybe in a few years I'll be able to take him to a Hooters. Sorry to make a new thread just for this, but this city council ruling is so exciting. Oh, and the kid too. Do they sell infant Hooters shirts?
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:33 AM   #2
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Why was it overturned, and why is this a good thing?
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Old 02-22-2007, 08:46 AM   #3
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Well, probably because it was passed illegally to begin with. That's why Drew Swenson for the Riverwalk project was going to sue the city's ass off. In all that retail space he will have in the new building, only one of them could have been a chain under the old ordinance. That would have been a major dagger to the project.
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Old 02-22-2007, 09:13 AM   #4
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Im not sure I want a donwtown full of chains, but the area covered by that no-chain ordinance extended into bayside, which would have been bad news, and prohibitive to new development in that mostly industrial area. any successful non-chains wont be pushed out by this new ruling so I guess its ok.

Whole foods just bought wild oats, so it has gobbeld up the two pre-existing natural food markest in portland in like a year or less.
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Old 02-22-2007, 11:33 AM   #5
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oh and congrats on the new arrival, seriusly that is great news, thats awesome.
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Old 02-23-2007, 12:13 AM   #6
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Congrats on the kid! That's great news.

As for the ordinance, meh.
As an outsider, I'd rather see a place like Hooters go to someplace like S. Portand. I don't really see what value a Walgreens or twenty Dunkin Donuts is really going to add to the city. I could see the good for maybe the tax base, but at what cost to the character of the city? Patrick said that it won't force out established local stores. How? A Dunk's can easily undercut, overmarket, and pay a higher rent than any local coffee shop. Unless you have some really civic minded locals and landlords in the city I don't see how the local shops can compete with the chains.
I probably shouldn't even be weighing in on this till I have a better understanding of what it actually means for the city, but just going by what you are saying about it, it seems like a Pandora's Box to me.

Like the t-shirts says: "Keep Portland Independent"
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:27 AM   #7
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If local businesses couldn't make it with chains around, then Quizno's would be open and Henry VIII's would be closed. TGIF would still be there and Norm's would be closed.

As fare as coffee, we have two Starbucks and two Dunkin Donuts downtown. We also have Arabica, Breaking New Grounds, Coffee By Design, Javanet, Portland Coffee Roasters, Bagel Works, and Zarrah's. Local places make it a lot easier than chains here.
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Old 02-23-2007, 09:28 AM   #8
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Can you tell me more about the formula business ordinance? How long has it been around? Was it just for new construction or existing retail space as well?


Also: Did you get much sleep last night?
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Old 02-23-2007, 10:21 AM   #9
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Statler -- I said Successful local businesses wouldnt be pushed out. unsuccessful ones, well, they are a different story. but most of our locally owned shops and stores are very successful, as was highlighted by gritty's. so while I agree with you that we should kepe portland independent, I dont think an ordinance like this is needed to accomplish that. I think the market itself would keep portland independent, as our local appeal really is what we thrive on and without it there would be no demand for chains anway--because no one would visit here in the first place. hmmmmm...im in bostno right now on vacation...should I drive up to portland, which is less exciting, smaller, colder, and more hickish just to see a hooters, dunkin donuts, and wal-mart? yeah right who would do that? they wouldnt, and officials in the city know that, as does everyone else, including residents of the city and surrounding area (who dont want to drive in-town to see dunks or wal-mart) so there is absolutely no risk of portland becoming over-run with chains. especially in our core, where tourists flock. but my tiff with this ordinace is that it extends far beyond the arts district and old port, to include bayside, which is an industrial dump, so prohibiting chains there would make sure that no one visited there, and that would be no different from the current situation (as no one goes into a scrap yard to hang out for leisure). allowing chains in bayside would bring some of the mall development to an underused section of the city, and chains should be allwed there. I am rambling and not forming a clear argument here, perhaps, but I am at work and rushing before my next call comes in and I really do have good reasons for believing chains are needed in portland (in certain sections). and p.s. gritty's there are three dunkin donuts down town -- congress street, old port, and one city center first floor. I dont mind dunkin donuts, kinkos, etc downtown...because they can all squeeze into little spots...but the day I see a 6 lane inner congress street or fore street with an outback steak house, bordered by a gap, linens and things and shaws, all with giant parking lots, is the day I am moving to manchester. [/i]
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Old 02-23-2007, 10:24 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by statler
Can you tell me more about the formula business ordinance? How long has it been around? Was it just for new construction or existing retail space as well?


Also: Did you get much sleep last night?
It was passed three months ago when business man wanted to bring a hooters to his congress street location/business. It would have been in the stadium entertainment complex, which was previously home to a night club, and sports bar. it would have not been on congress street, but fronting the side street running off from congress. everyone got upset that a hooters was planned for the arts district (which techinically runs through that area, but which is pretty un-artsy most of the time). so the city passed an emergency ordinance, and that caused even more of an upset because it was aimed at preventing one business along congress street (hooters) but its affect would have ranged as far as extending into a new office building under construction in the old port (custom hosue wharf) and it would have prohibited a chain restaurant in the first floor of that building. it also would have extended into bayside, which is like a mile away and totally undeveloped dirt parking lots in dire need of development (of any sort, chain or local).
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Old 02-23-2007, 01:15 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Patrick
.... all with giant parking lots, is the day I am moving to manchester. [/i]
You sure you don't mean Madision????

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Old 02-23-2007, 01:48 PM   #12
Patrick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindyCity
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick
.... all with giant parking lots, is the day I am moving to manchester. [/i]
You sure you don't mean Madision????

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Old 02-24-2007, 09:23 AM   #13
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Gritty's - congrats on the boy!

My two cents on the repeal of the ordinance: it's a good thing. I always try to patronize local businesses first, no matter where I live, and I certainly tried to do that in Portland. That said, there are some things I just could never really get in downtown Portland, basic clothing items being the main thing. If a Gap or Banana Republic wanted to open up in one of the empty storefronts on Congress Street, I would have no problem with it. The reality is that most downtowns are full of chain stores, the key is making them conform to design standards of the area.

For instance, here in DC there is a hip area called Georgetown, which is very historic but it also full of chains. However, the chains are required to blend in with the historic guidelines, so they're really not that offensive. And it means people go to Georgetown to shop rather than out to the malls in the suburbs.

So I think it's imperative that business be encouraged downtown, because the more people shopping in the chains, the more people will be shopping at the local places, too.
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Old 02-24-2007, 05:26 PM   #14
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Im with you max.
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