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Design a Better Boston Are you disappointed with the state of Boston's current architecture/development? Think you have a better idea? Post it here.

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Old 08-14-2017, 02:35 PM   #2461
jklo
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Re: Boston 2024

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Originally Posted by bigpicture7 View Post
Bargaining is assymetric when it comes to this stuff. I can't just "not buy" my commute on a given morning because my job is not instantly portable, my family not instantly movable. I am indeed at the mercy of my city. These assymetries of bargaining power are exactly how sweatshops exploit labor elsewhere: they put people into asymmetric situations where they have no other near-term choice.
Welcome to 2017. We're pretty much there.
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Old 08-14-2017, 02:59 PM   #2462
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Re: Boston 2024

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Welcome to 2017. We're pretty much there.
Not sure if you meant we are pretty much @ sweatshops, or pretty much at instantly portable jobs and families.

If you meant the latter, I actually think that's one of the bigger fallacies of modern times. Sure we have a lot of tech to deal with telecommuting, but there's still a huge premium placed on in-person interactions. Plus, be careful about the privilege assumed by what you imply - even in high-tech times where white collar workers can telecommute, high-touch, in-person service work is still a big part of the urban workforce...and these are the people that often live far from the city core.

If you have a job that you can quit instantly for a better one, on a whim, whenever/wherever...or one for which you never need to leave your house...then congrats to you. But for most, the labor market is more bargaining-power-asymmetric than product markets. The customers actually rule when it comes to cereal, shoes, clothes, etc. Not so with jobs.

Plus, if no one needed to commute into or work within our city, then we wouldn't need a city (or transit, or buildings, or parks)...it could just be like The Matrix where we're all just plugged into a pod : )
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Old 08-15-2017, 11:30 PM   #2463
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Re: Boston 2024

The main/original point wasn't that we don't need transit for getting around or to make people's lives better, the point was we didn't need a four week surge in demand by athletes, press and visitors to and from temporary venues to create a justification to create permanent infrastructure... we should build what we need to support the kind of long term development we want. Or not.

Boston 2024 should have been treated like planning logistics for an event, because that is what it is.
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Old 08-16-2017, 07:21 AM   #2464
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Re: Boston 2024

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Originally Posted by tangent View Post
The main/original point wasn't that we don't need transit for getting around or to make people's lives better, the point was we didn't need a four week surge in demand by athletes, press and visitors to and from temporary venues to create a justification to create permanent infrastructure... we should build what we need to support the kind of long term development we want. Or not.

Boston 2024 should have been treated like planning logistics for an event, because that is what it is.
I don't disagree, but just to clarify, I took the liberty of assuming that this thread was a bit less constrained now that the olympics are dead...

And so I took the opportunity to point out that we have no other funding vehicle remotely visible on the horizon for any of the things I listed. And that that's sad.

(if there are such potential funds and I'm just not aware, feel free to brighten my day)
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Old 08-16-2017, 08:00 PM   #2465
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Re: Boston 2024

It would seem the projects now proposed + permitted will have us reaching a place where our transit will need to be running with extreme reliability, and several of the most intelligent add-ons contained in your future T maps moving forward.
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Old 08-16-2017, 09:01 PM   #2466
DominusNovus
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Re: Boston 2024

Quote:
Originally Posted by tangent View Post
The main/original point wasn't that we don't need transit for getting around or to make people's lives better, the point was we didn't need a four week surge in demand by athletes, press and visitors to and from temporary venues to create a justification to create permanent infrastructure... we should build what we need to support the kind of long term development we want. Or not.

Boston 2024 should have been treated like planning logistics for an event, because that is what it is.
Given how long its taken us to build anything transit related, I can't help but think that a kick in the pants to build out our infrastructure would be useful.
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Old 08-16-2017, 10:41 PM   #2467
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Re: Boston 2024

At the risk of ending up slicing my wrists, I'll bite: What "funding vehicle" was available to pay for transit upgrades / improvements / additions due to the Olympics (tm) coming to Boston?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpicture7 View Post

... I took the opportunity to point out that we have no other funding vehicle remotely visible on the horizon for any of the things I listed. And that that's sad.

(if there are such potential funds and I'm just not aware, feel free to brighten my day)
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Old 08-17-2017, 07:35 AM   #2468
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Re: Boston 2024

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Originally Posted by JohnAKeith View Post
At the risk of ending up slicing my wrists, I'll bite: What "funding vehicle" was available to pay for transit upgrades / improvements / additions due to the Olympics (tm) coming to Boston?
No viable one, John.

There wasn't a viable one before Boston2024, there wasn't a viable one via Boston2024, and there isn't a viable one now.
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Old 08-17-2017, 12:51 PM   #2469
tangent
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Re: Boston 2024

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpicture7 View Post
I don't disagree, but just to clarify, I took the liberty of assuming that this thread was a bit less constrained now that the olympics are dead...

And so I took the opportunity to point out that we have no other funding vehicle remotely visible on the horizon for any of the things I listed. And that that's sad.

(if there are such potential funds and I'm just not aware, feel free to brighten my day)
The "funding vehicle" is what I take issue with. You need funding yes... you need to justify funding yes... you need project XYZ for the Olympics... No.

Basing your public policy on misleading the public will undermine public trust and diminishes the amount of money people are willing to trust with the government.

If these projects are actually worth it, then we should be able to pull together the numbers to prove it.
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Old 08-18-2017, 06:30 PM   #2470
jklo
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Re: Boston 2024

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Originally Posted by bigpicture7 View Post
Not sure if you meant we are pretty much @ sweatshops, or pretty much at instantly portable jobs and families.
Basically for what good jobs are left, companies are consolidating to small areas in the US because they can get away with it and things like Cost of Living, etc, don't matter anymore. Why go to Middle America when you can be in Downtown Boston and pay some millennial the same salary or less?

Boston's big advantage is the colleges (cheap educated labor!) and the MBTA which has better coverage than most of other US cities. Even if it sucks/is slow. So it's sort of like it would make people's lives easier if they did make some infrastructure improvements but at the same time it's not like people will leave if it doesn't happen. Because where else are they going to go?
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Old 08-18-2017, 06:48 PM   #2471
bigpicture7
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Re: Boston 2024

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Originally Posted by jklo View Post
Basically for what good jobs are left, companies are consolidating to small areas in the US because they can get away with it and things like Cost of Living, etc, don't matter anymore. Why go to Middle America when you can be in Downtown Boston and pay some millennial the same salary or less?

Boston's big advantage is the colleges (cheap educated labor!) and the MBTA which has better coverage than most of other US cities. Even if it sucks/is slow. So it's sort of like it would make people's lives easier if they did make some infrastructure improvements but at the same time it's not like people will leave if it doesn't happen. Because where else are they going to go?
Yes, yes, yes. That is precisely what I meant. Asymmetric bargaining in labor markets means exactly what you just described above, and it is strategic and intentional on behalf of employers. I am not "complaining" so much as just pointing out that it is natural - and it is why the majority of people can stare at a problem like transit and all feel it ought to be different, and yet we still don't have the voting-with-our-feet leverage to instill change (the way we do in consumer markets by boycotting products / selecting alternatives).


(Thank you)
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