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Old 12-03-2014, 12:06 PM   #261
whighlander
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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Go to Bedford Street and Hartwell Ave. in Lexington. I take the bus there for dept. meetings every now and then. This is one of the least walkable areas I've been too.

The bus gets ya there, but then drops you off across 4 lanes (plus the routing around the island) of non-stop high speed traffic. No pedestrian lights, no cross walks, and the whole point of that stop is to get you to Hartwell, that you can't get to without playing Frogger.
They finally added a sidewalk on the south side of hartwell too, thankfully. But, it ends before the return bus stop at a telephone pole. This is one of my least favorite examples of sprawl and the nightmare of office parks. It's all about the car. Everyone in the park drives 50 down to the intersection as well and makes two lanes each way despite the lack of markings to allow this.

Lexington Center on the other hand, very nice and walkable.

The funny thing to me though, is how much people who work in these places love it, and the "convenience'. And, us who work in the city are out of our minds. They were literally scared for my safety when I told them I take the bus.

This is something people on this board always try to forget. We are very much outnumbered by those who think the above is the better way. We may rail against it, and think it's our duty to change that perception, but many don't want it changed and will not see our point of view. Who are we to tell them they are wrong? Goose and Gander.
\

Seamus -- Hartwell Ave is not an Office Park its a street connecting Mass Ave to Bedford Street via Wood St. -- and by the way its also a principle egress from Hanscom Air Force Base and a connector to Bedford via McGuire Rd.

The reason you don't see an Urban Grid is that Hartwell separates a swamp [Tophet] with a major Power Line right of way and the Lexington Town recycling complex [formerly town dump] from Westview cemetery [former site of an amusement park built by the Lexington and Boston Street Railway] and the aforementioned Hanscom Air Force Base -- so there was only a narrow strip which could be developed

The original buildings were one story industrial facilities with major amounts of parking such as the Varian Vacuum facility located next to the entrance to the base -- current uses are a mix of Bio-labs and high tech offices
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Old 12-03-2014, 12:56 PM   #262
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

Womp. Let's make a "Lexington" thread, or something. This thread is for the Tower in the Park.
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Old 12-03-2014, 02:22 PM   #263
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

If it looks like a duck..... it's an office park.
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Old 12-03-2014, 02:30 PM   #264
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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I'm sorry but I really don't see a profound difference in the local urbanity between East Lexington and Cambridge a block or two away from Mass Ave -- North of Harvard before Porter or right on Huron & Raymond right by Concord Ave North of Harvard. Both feature mostly single family houses with lots -- the Cambridge ones are larger.
I've lived in this area and walked most of these streets extensively, there is a huge difference between Cambridge and even East Arlington that's easy to notice if you are paying attention. The Cambridge side has more multi unit buildings, far more triple deckers, fewer setbacks from the sidewalk and less space between buildings for driveways. It's not a seamless transitions - there are occasional "urban feeling" streets in East Arlington and more "suburban feeling" streets in North Cambridge, but the proportion change on each side of the brook is very noticible. Now it's true Cambridge has some areas of mostly large single family homes, but these are mostly in West Cambridge, which is the designated low density district - which happens to have similar density to all of Arlington.

Even if you just stick to Mass Ave, where the "peak" urban activity ends a few blocks north of Porter, slowly diminishes, picks up slightly at Trolley Square and then mostly diminishes to almost nothing soon after crossing the border, then slowly picks up to East Arlington and Arlington Center, where it becomes a nice, sizable town center but hardly something you can describe as "urban". All Arlington really has that elevates it above the standard town center are a bunch older, taller apartment buildings, but they are pretty spread out. You can certainly feel the potential in Arlington to extend the city feel, but it falls noticeably short from Cambridge. Perhaps if the Red Line extension got built we'd be having a different conversation.
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Old 12-03-2014, 03:19 PM   #265
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

[quote=whighlander;219793]Nico -- have you ever been in Lexington [excepting the tourist picture in front of Captain Parker?

It's quite an assumption to assume that I've never been to Lexington. It's not some exotic far off place, and being a resident of, you realize that you don't need a passport to gain entry. It's a town on 128. A beautiful and wealthy town at that, but let's not cloud it's description w/so much bs as to miss-classify it, using any reasonable definition as anything other than suburban. It is a quaint New England suburb. A fine place.
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Old 12-03-2014, 03:20 PM   #266
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

So, about that apartment building on Lomasney way...
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Old 12-04-2014, 12:25 AM   #267
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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So, about that apartment building on Lomasney way...
hey come on man, I want to show whig some very "urban" pics I took on the Arlington/Lexington border, don't ruin it for me!





In all seriousness, there doesn't seem to be much happening on this apartment building. I was hoping the community meeting would yield more info than it has.
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Old 12-04-2014, 07:51 AM   #268
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

^Gray building in the last picture represents approximate massing West End residents would like.
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Old 12-04-2014, 09:41 AM   #269
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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^Gray building in the last picture represents approximate massing West End residents would like.
The Port-a-john? Lol.

Really though, New England town centers are tricky to place, but I would describe them as "Main Street urbanism". Most New England towns have highly walkable, livable town centers with a good streetscape for pedestrians, active streetwalls, and higher density than the big lot suburbs that surround them.

That doesn't make Lexington, Arlington, Concord, etc., urban. They're suburbs... moving toward exurbs... But the tendency towards old town centers and villages makes them more "urban" in those few blocks than what we tend to think "suburban" communities are - which would be majority of Lexington that's outside the "Main Streets" areas. The forests and farms that were turned into subdivisions in the post-war suburban boom, and are still being developed into ever growing mcmansions (I work for Lexington Public Schools, so I'm very aware of the goings on in town).

Ugh. But can we take this conversation a new (or more relevant) thread?

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Old 12-04-2014, 02:52 PM   #270
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

SO HOW BOUT THAT TOWER?
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Old 12-05-2014, 08:09 AM   #271
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

I think it will get approved, especially since there is already one under construction across the street and a bigger one approved near that one.
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Old 12-06-2014, 10:24 PM   #272
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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The Port-a-john? Lol.

Really though, New England town centers are tricky to place, but I would describe them as "Main Street urbanism"....

That doesn't make Lexington, Arlington, Concord, etc., urban. They're suburbs... moving toward exurbs...

Ugh. But can we take this conversation a new (or more relevant) thread?
Buses -- a lot of water has passed under the dam on this topic -- so to help with the distinctions here is a table of many Greater Boston and a few other places ordered by population density

Quote:
Density Rank Form Density Pop Area
1 SOMERVILLE City 18,617.8 76,519 4.11
2 CAMBRIDGE City 16,491.1 106,038 6.43
3 CHELSEA City 16,278.1 35,649 2.19
4 BOSTON City 12,907.0 625,087 48.43
5 EVERETT City 12,455.9 42,101 3.38
6 MALDEN City 11,848.3 60,071 5.07
7 LAWRENCE City 11,059.8 76,976 6.96
8 WINTHROP Town 8,913.1 17,737 1.99
10 BROOKLINE Town 8,708.7 59,132 6.79
11 LYNN City 8,414.0 91,040 10.82
12 ARLINGTON Town 8,357.1 43,290 5.18
13 WATERTOWN Town 7,846.2 32,248 4.11
14 LOWELL City 7,812.9 107,584 13.77
15 MEDFORD City 6,970.3 56,738 8.14
16 MELROSE Town 5,813.0 27,263 4.69
17 QUINCY City 5,536.9 92,909 16.78
18 BELMONT Town 5,362.0 24,987 4.66
19 SALEM City 5,142.5 41,654 8.1
20 WORCESTER City 4,835.8 181,631 37.56
21 WALTHAM City 4,817.4 61,181 12.7
23 NEWTON City 4,761.5 85,945 18.05
24 NEW BEDFORD City 4,730.8 95,183 20.12
26 MARBLEHEAD Town 4,407.1 19,964 4.53
27 BROCKTON City 4,392.9 94,316 21.47
28 WINCHESTER Town 3,575.2 21,594 6.04
29 STONEHAM Town 3,521.8 21,659 6.15
31 WAKEFIELD Town 3,372.3 25,191 7.47
33 WEYMOUTH Town 3,181.4 54,116 17.01
34 PEABODY City 3,149.6 51,653 16.4
35 WOBURN City 3,040.3 38,520 12.67
38 WELLESLEY Town 2,765.4 28,152 10.18
39 NORWOOD Town 2,748.2 28,801 10.48
36 FALL RIVER City 2,867.9 88,962 31.02
40 FRAMINGHAM Town 2,746.5 68,991 25.12
43 SAUGUS Town 2,441.9 26,836 10.99
48 NEEDHAM Town 2,306.3 29,083 12.61
50 NATICK Town 2,211.5 33,349 15.08
52 BURLINGTON Town 2,096.1 24,755 11.81
53 NEWBURYPORT City 2,094.5 17,552 8.38
58 LEXINGTON Town 1,934.0 31,718 16.4
62 HAVERHILL City 1,840.7 61,351 33.33
73 CHELMSFORD Town 1,508.0 34,156 22.65
75 FITCHBURG City 1,457.1 40,449 27.76
77 LEOMINSTER City 1,416.1 40,898 28.88
84 WILMINGTON Town 1,316.8 22,557 17.13
88 TAUNTON City 1,200.2 55,940 46.61
91 WALPOLE Town 1,179.8 24,234 20.54
92 LYNNFIELD Town 1,152.6 11,687 10.14
94 CANTON Town 1,146.9 21,710 18.93
98 GLOUCESTER City 1,117.6 29,014 25.96
102 NORTH ANDOVER Town 1,072.1 28,571 26.65
110 BEDFORD Town 979.3 13,455 13.74
113 GARDNER City 914.5 20,293 22.19
121 FOXBOROUGH Town 845.8 16,983 20.08
145 CONCORD Town 715.7 17,836 24.92
141 SUDBURY Town 732.2 17,843 24.37
144 WESTFORD Town 724.6 22,181 30.61
153 WESTON Town 668.1 11,371 17.02
169 PLYMOUTH Town 588.5 56,767 96.46
171 HOPKINTON Town 567.8 15,080 26.56
176 LITTLETON Town 542.5 9,017 16.62
178 HAMILTON Town 536.0 7,826 14.6
192 LINCOLN Town 447.5 6,430 14.37
196 IPSWICH Town 407.6 13,279 32.58
216 CARLISLE Town 319.2 4,903 15.36
242 HARVARD Town 248.0 6,537 26.36
330 FLORIDA Village 30.7 748 24.36
347 WASHINGTON Village 14.2 535 37.76
0 Massachusetts 858.0 6,692,824 7,800
00 US non Alaska 106.5 315,393,707 2,961,264
000 US total 89.5 316,128,839 3,531,905

You will note that:
1) the Cities the obvious expressions of urban dominate the top 30 although there are 9 suburbs {Towns}
2) The lowest density city Gardner #110 is essentially equal in density to the well known Boston suburb of Bedford #113
3) The Mean and Median density for the Greater Boston cities:
a) 8315.794444 mean of cities
b) 6674.9 median of cities
The Mean and Median density for the Greater Boston towns:
a) 2512.994872 mean of towns
b) 1508 median of towns
The Mean and median of Greater Boston:
a) 4390.713793 Mean of Greater Boston
b) 2756.8 Median of Greater Boston

4) Exurbs as typically defined include towns such as LITTLETON, HAMILTON, IPSWICH, CARLISLE, HARVARD with mean densities of about 1/2 the Massachusetts average of 858

5) Rural areas are clustered in the #200 and have densities of the US average or less

4) Several towns well within 128 have city-like densities including: WINTHROP, BROOKLINE, ARLINGTON, WATERTOWN

5) Lexington @ about 2X Massachusetts Avg. and 1/2 the Greater Boston average is a typical suburb by this definition

6) Due to the dense single family building in the immediate post WWII period East Lexington more closely resembles Arlington than it does the rest of Lexington
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Old 12-06-2014, 11:35 PM   #273
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

^ Not sure what your point is with this. My point is that MA towns are not uniform. Main Streets areas are fairly dense, while areas beyond are much more suburban/big lot, single family. Town density numbers neither support nor dispute that claim.
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Old 12-07-2014, 09:02 AM   #274
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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^ Not sure what your point is with this. My point is that MA towns are not uniform. Main Streets areas are fairly dense, while areas beyond are much more suburban/big lot, single family. Town density numbers neither support nor dispute that claim.
Main point visible in the data is that there are small compact towns with densities greater than those of all but the densest cities

Beyond the gross densities of course there is substantial variation in the neighborhood by neighborhood density -- thus Hyde Park is probably less dense than the immediate Mass Ave strip in Arlington

The overall point is that the term Suburban which might be well defined in Ohio or California is essentially meaningless in Greater Boston
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Old 12-07-2014, 03:15 PM   #275
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

Is there a moderator in the house?? Your services are in desperate need!
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Old 12-07-2014, 05:51 PM   #276
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

oops! I was trying to change the subject.
Reposting to correct thread.

Last edited by BeeLine; 12-07-2014 at 10:17 PM.
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Old 12-07-2014, 08:28 PM   #277
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

So wait, I'm confused: do the garden garage towers = Nashua street tower? Or the three towers that are planned for in front of the garden?

Are these towers their own thing?
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Old 12-07-2014, 08:45 PM   #278
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

Beeline stuck the pics in the wrong thread. Different projects.
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Old 12-08-2014, 10:05 AM   #279
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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So wait, I'm confused: do the garden garage towers = Nashua street tower? Or the three towers that are planned for in front of the garden?

Are these towers their own thing?
Nashua Street is different and is already underconstruction.

This WAS 2 towers and now is 1 tower and a small park.
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Old 12-08-2014, 11:56 PM   #280
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Re: Garden Garage Towers (Basketball City) | 35 Lomasney Way | West End

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Nashua Street is different and is already underconstruction.

This WAS 2 towers and now is 1 tower and a small park.
So between this, the Nashua Tower, and the towers in front of the Garden, that's 4-5 towers all being built within a block of each other?!

And what's the deal with all the empty space between the garden and the river? Would towers ever be built there as well?

We ought to rename this block Little Toronto or Little Chicago or something.
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