Renaissance Seaport Hotel

[xec]

http://static.flickr.com/51/114314494_de20e92bd4_o.jpg

Some pics taken on 6/12. Late in the day so the quality is poor.
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A shindig was in progress celebrating the opening of a restaurant. It was actually pleasant to walk around the area. The architecture is banal but with people and activity it's not completely the center of attention. As a backdrop it's less offensive than when there was nothing around to distract from its monolithic bulk.
http://static.flickr.com/75/166796057_0758eb9935_b.jpg

Seaport Blvd is starting to look like a real street.
http://static.flickr.com/67/166796059_a8c939dd07_o.jpg

[lexicon506]

^if only the streets were half that size....

[tocoto]

Wide streets don't kill a city per se. DC has lots of wide streets but they are punctuated with circles, small parks and monumnets. The buildings are generally short letting in light, and there are plenty of small businesses along the streets. The seaport has short enough buildings that the wide streets could work if the buildings are porous and there are plently of businesses and residents so it's lively. It's far from perfect down there but it still might be pretty nice in 5 or 10 years.

[Waldorf]

First pic:

The Manulife building looks amazing in that light.

Noticed the modern street lights...goes well in the area.

Last pic: I don't mind wide streets either, they can work. One question, why don't they paint the lane lines? I've noticed this on Cambridge St in Allston, stretches of Mass Ave in Cambridge and Arlington. What's the deal? (and don't tell me it's because of the plowing and salt). No wonder we are all such bad drivers.

[chumbolly]

One question, why don't they paint the lane lines? I've noticed this on Cambridge St in Allston, stretches of Mass Ave in Cambridge and Arlington. What's the deal? (and don't tell me it's because of the plowing and salt). No wonder we are all such bad drivers. I may be totally wrong on this point, but I think that the no-lines thing is a new traffic calming technique. It definitely slows down traffic in Arlington because people don't know where the hell to drive.

[Waldorf]

^ are you serious?

[callahan]

I think the wide streets work well in that area. They tend to distinguish it from the rest of the city, whic, in my opinion, is not such a bad thing. Don't get me wrong. I think Boston is generally a beautiful city. But it's nice to go into different neighborhoods and get a different feeling. This, being the newest most updated area should feel more contemporary.

[statler]

^ are you serious?
There are better sources but this was the first thing came up on a quick google search:
Reversing decades of conventional wisdom on traffic engineering, Hamilton-Baillie argues that the key to improving both safety and vehicular capacity is to remove traffic lights and other controls, such as stop signs and the white and yellow lines dividing streets into lanes. Without any clear right-of-way, he says, motorists are forced to slow down to safer speeds, make eye contact with pedestrians, cyclists and other drivers, and decide among themselves when it is safe to proceed.
Link (http://www.kottke.org/04/06/traffic-calming)

[PerfectHandle]

Whenever street lights go off, everyone gets all cautious. It's wild.

[Ron Newman]

The intersection of Brighton Avenue and Comm. Ave. used to have this system, and it worked pretty well. I don't know why the city gave up on it and installed a traffic light a few years ago.

[quadratdackel]

Wow, positive comments and optimism about the Waterfront. I have been gone for a while.

...I prefer the narrower streets. The DC comparison's a good one. I don't like DC streets as much in part because they're so wide. I feel drivers are much more hostile towards pedestrians, like pedestrians have no right to be crossing their streets, whereas in Boston pedestrians are more respected. That said, I can appreciate having some diversity in our neighborhoods, and certainly the Waterfront will do that. One of my favorite parts of Boston is how quickly and radically neighborhoods change (such as skyscrapers next to brownstones in Back Bay etc), and this will add a new dimension to that. Now if only they'd hurry up and build the neighborhood out...

[DudeUrSistersHot]

One question, why don't they paint the lane lines? I've noticed this on Cambridge St in Allston, stretches of Mass Ave in Cambridge and Arlington. What's the deal? (and don't tell me it's because of the plowing and salt). No wonder we are all such bad drivers. I may be totally wrong on this point, but I think that the no-lines thing is a new traffic calming technique. It definitely slows down traffic in Arlington because people don't know where the hell to drive.

That's like making assault and battery legal because it will make more people be careful.

[Patrick]

well, actually, its nothing of the sort.

I can see how that would calm traffic. If you're not sure where you have the right to be, you feel less inclined to exercise your ownership over a particular lane or sphere of travel (in my mind that is the biggest underlying factor of road rage).

nothing has been made 'legal.'

when something is clearly spelled out, like traffic lines indicate clearly where one is allowed to be, then it is easy to know what you can and cannot get away with, and so people are more likely to engage in behavior they know they are likely to get away with. but by erasing the lines, people question who has the right of way, etc, and are thus less sure of their own actions and less likely to be angered when someone does something stupid (because in the end they are not sure if its a result of their own mistake). i think chumbolly is on to something.

[lexicon506]

In my experience driving around Boston, it seems like people don't really notice that there are lanes in the road. So I say if people are only going to use lanes as guidelines, what's the point in spending money to draw them? :)

[Waldorf]

I think they would stay in their own lanes if the lanes were consistently and clearly marked.

I'll give you an example: there are no lane markings on Harvard Ave at the intersection of Comm Ave. This presents a problem because Harvard Ave is wide enough to accommodate three lanes of traffic at the intersection. This is fine except that half the time nobody knows which lane is the through lane.

So what you have is three lanes of cars all trying to go straight and trying to merge into one - some drivers floor it while others come to a complete stop in the middle of the trolley tracks. Chaos ensues, tempers flare.

This is why Boston DPW needs to stop being lazy and do some real work. Paint the damn lines, fix the street lights and make real repairs to those holes that Nstar likes to make.

Now, getting back to the to the waterfront. I think we should have a narrower street here. One lane of traffic in each direction. Talk about simplicity!

[bosdevelopment]

I think they would stay in their own lanes if the lanes were consistently and clearly marked.

I'll give you an example: there are no lane markings on Harvard Ave at the intersection of Comm Ave. This presents a problem because Harvard Ave is wide enough to accommodate three lanes of traffic at the intersection. This is fine except that half the time nobody knows which lane is the through lane.

So what you have is three lanes of cars all trying to go straight and trying to merge into one - some drivers floor it while others come to a complete stop in the middle of the trolley tracks. Chaos ensues, tempers flare.

This is why Boston DPW needs to stop being lazy and do some real work. Paint the damn lines, fix the street lights and make real repairs to those holes that Nstar likes to make.

Now, getting back to the to the waterfront. I think we should have a narrower street here. One lane of traffic in each direction. Talk about simplicity!

This intersection is the bane of my existence. I hit it every morning at around 8:15 and everyone half asleep doesnt know what the hell to do. It would make abundant sense to make lines in this intersection. I'm the type that always pushes to make a new lane and floor it so get the hell out of the way!(I almost hit a biker this morning coincidentally)

[chumbolly]

Sorry to keep off topic, but back to traffic calming -- I remember that in Ablarc's great (lost) essay on the town Prince Charles built, HRH deliberately got rid of raised sidewalks so that cars and people would be sharing the same space. That technique definitely slows cars down, as I've subsequently seen in person in a couple small Swedish villages that were built long before cars were dreamed of. Of course, a village and a city are two different animals, but it is interesting the effect taking away the trappings of demarcated territory has on people, especially drivers. I've always felt people in cars were more likely to be assholey than people on foot because they feel protected in their cars, and thus, licensed to be an ass. Maybe taking away the protections of traffic lanes is just disconcerting enough that it makes people respect the drivers around them. If it works, I'm for it, though only where appropriate.

[quadratdackel]

Reminds me of a former econ prof who liked talking about how as car safety features have improved over the years, injury/death of people in cars due to accidents has remained about flat- people just drive riskier, because they (we) have a certain intrinsic tolerance for risk and will push our driving up to it. He then said that if you want to make cars safe, put a big spike sticking out of the steering wheel towards the driver. People in cars would still have the same injury/death rates, but pedestrians/etc would get hurt less because drivers would be highly cautious lest they get bludgeoned. Of course, then driving would suck, but that wasn't the point. (For the record, despite my aversion to the automobile, I am not advocating anything to this effect.)

(I almost hit a biker this morning coincidentally)
Hope it wasn't me. ...Seriously, be careful there. Our lives are in your hands.

[tocoto]

After 30 + years of driving:

Drinking is the number one bane to safety.

Impatience is next.

Both are more more common among the young by nature.

Lanes help keep traffic organized and that prevents accidents.

Speed kills.

Seat belts are crucial.

My mantra:
Put on the seat belt.
Drive with calm and equanimity
Let the assholes pass

walk or bike when you can.

[bosdevelopment]

(I almost hit a biker this morning coincidentally)
Hope it wasn't me. ...Seriously, be careful there. Our lives are in your hands.[/quote]

Bikers are a serious safety issue when driving. I would say that our lives are in each others' hands. If I were to hit and kill a biker who was in the middle of the road the life that I know and enjoy would be over all because some dick thought 117 was the tour de france. I'm sure bikers cause 1000's of accidents a year.

[Coyote137]

first attempt at posting photos. have a bunch from the last couple weeks, will try and post them over the next couple days.

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[bostonman]

Boston's first Renaissance hotel expected to open in December 2007

To the sound of bagpipes and drum, a 25-foot-long steel beam, painted white and decorated with a US flag and signatures of steelworkers from Local 7 and others, was raised this morning at the topping-off of the Renaissance Boston Waterfront Hotel in South Boston.

Executives from Renaissance Hotels & Resorts and officials from the Massachusetts Port Authority, Boston Redevelopment Authority, Boston Convention & Exhibition Center, and Payton Construction Co. joined workers for the event, one year after ground was broken on the 471-room hotel at D and Congress streets. The Renaissance is expected to open in December 2007.

The hotel, adjacent to the Park Lane Seaport residences and the new Legal Test Kitchen restaurant, will have 21 suites, flat-panel televisions, connections for laptop computers and MP3 players, and wireless Internet access.

The Renaissance Boston Waterfront, designed by The Stubbins Associates of Cambridge and to be operated by Marriott International Inc., will have a seafood restaurant operated by Marriott, a Starbucks, and two ballrooms.

The 21-story hotel, Boston's first Renaissance, will share parking with the nearby residences, apartments, and condominiums that are being completed and now are being occupied.
(By Thomas C. Palmer Jr., Globe staff)

Posted by Boston Globe Business Team at 11:52 AM

http://www.boston.com/business/ticker/2006/09/bostons_first_r.html

[statler]

471-room waterfront hotel gets a steel topping-off

September 29, 2006

To the sound of bagpipes and drum, a 25-foot-long steel beam, painted white and decorated with a US flag and signatures of steelworkers from Local 7 and others, was raised at the topping-off of the Renaissance Boston Waterfront Hotel in South Boston. Construction on the 471-room hotel at D and Congress streets began a year ago; it is expected to open in December 2007. The hotel, adjacent to the Park Lane Seaport residences and the Legal Test Kitchen restaurant, will have 21 suites. The hotel, designed by The Stubbins Associates of Cambridge, will be operated by Marriott International Inc. (Thomas C. Palmer Jr.)
Link (http://www.boston.com/business/globe/articles/2006/09/29/471_room_waterfront_hotel_gets_a_steel_topping_off/)

[xec]

The Renaissance hotel this afternoon.
http://static.flickr.com/80/269679103_8d214ed15a_b.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/113/269679104_f01ece06ca_b.jpg

The precast panels have made their appearance. Expect the plague to spread to Fan Pier sometime next year.
http://static.flickr.com/82/269679106_236395a559_b.jpg

http://static.flickr.com/108/269679107_45b17443e7_b.jpg

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Looks like a parking garage. Maybe it wil improve once the windows are in.
http://static.flickr.com/80/269681730_7f58a84bb0_o.jpg

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They just blend one into the other.
http://static.flickr.com/109/269681732_dad82ce035_b.jpg

[briv]

Xec, thanks for the update.

Its a shame the developer decided to cheap out on this buildings skin. Its curving facade could of really went well with Manulife HQ across the street. I mean, look at this:



http://static.flickr.com/65/197528495_ad19fd6748_o.jpg



These two could have been really striking together.

But these materials make me want to yak. The building still has its redeeming qualities, but back when it was just steel you could see its true potential.

[gravedigger4444]

From the Tobin Bridge, the area is beginning to have a quite noticeable "skyline".

[Mike]

http://www.lesvants.com/stock_web%20gallery%20images_pages/Boston/boston_11-4-06/images/11-4-06_stock_boston_3680-140%20copy.jpg

[vanshnookenraggen]

Holy shit that's ugly. At least this area will be the first to go when global warming increases the sea level.

[ablarc]

http://static.flickr.com/62/197528501_8ef4b77372_o.jpg
An inspiring view.

.

[riserise]

at least its dense and urban - a minor victory

[Joe_Schmoe]

at least its dense and urban - a minor victory

Normally I'd think you were kidding, but I get the sense you're being serious.

Dense and urban:

https://wfs.bc.edu/bowesst/1923a.JPG

Suburban office park:

http://www.lesvants.com/stock_web%20gallery%20images_pages/Boston/boston_11-4-06/images/11-4-06_stock_boston_3680-140%20copy.jpg

[riserise]

when the other blocks fill up just as dense - there'll start to be some critical mass. not to say there will be good street life. but the artery will have to be bridged there to connect the neighborhood - er developments - by the convention center. also, the ornamental space in front of the first world trade center office building needs to be developed into a low rise pavilion of active uses to help define the wonderful seaport park there by halvershorn and machado/silvetti

[lexicon506]

Ugly or not, riserise is right that it is dense and will only get denser. But you need many more missing elements before you can call the Seaport an urban area.

[briv]

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y99/briv1/D_st.jpg

These few blocks look like they will have a density comparable to a typical Longwood area block--which is to say, it will be pretty dense. But just because it's dense doesn't mean it succeeds urbanistically, because it has some serious problems--particularly on Park Lane, where this hotel presents a big blank wall. Its pretty bad.

[ablarc]

These few blocks look like they will have a density comparable to a typical Longwood area block--which is to say, it will be pretty dense. But just because it's dense doesn't mean it succeeds urbanistically...
Increment of development is way too big.

[xec]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0702100033.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0702100037.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0702100043.jpg

[vanshnookenraggen]

I honestly hope that one day, far into the future, people will look back at the seaport and hold it as an example of a totally post-modern architectural district. These buildings are boring now but I hope that when they are all done they will work together like the warehouses of SoHo or the townhouses of the Back Bay.

[DudeUrSistersHot]

the problem is that those districts actually have life in them, they're dense and interesting and aren't filled with 70% useless parkland

[Joe_Schmoe]

They also don't have 6 lanes of traffic on the streets.

[kz1000ps]

I honestly hope that one day, far into the future, people will look back at the seaport and hold it as an example of a totally post-modern architectural district.

I really struggle to see that happening here, but I'd say such a place already exists in MIT's University Park. There's roughly 15 blocks of buildings all built within the last 15 years, and I don't think there's a single street wider than 70 feet. Plus, if it's any sign, I actually enjoy walking around the place, whereas I don't down by the seaport (note how I never have pictures of developments down there).

[PerfectHandle]

Let's relax a little bit. This district isn't even 20% finished. I'm not saying it'll be Back Bay's equal, but University Park would be a low bar to set.

[Scott]

The Harbor Lights/BOA Pavilion should get a permanent home.

[kz1000ps]

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/3196/img4233hm5.jpg

[vanshnookenraggen]

It blends in so well with the steel-gray sky you can almost not see it!

[briv]

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y99/briv1/DSCF0133.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y99/briv1/DSCF0129.jpg

[Waldorf]

The Seaport just doesn't do it for me...

[DudeUrSistersHot]

The Seaport just doesn't do it for me...


needs more parks and less shadows.

[statler]

Plus the roads need to be wider and the buildings need larger footprints and be clad with more red brick.

[Waldorf]

Throw in a little prefab and you've got yourself a world class neighborhood.

[palindrome]

then when the people move in, they willl be Nimby's and spur any future hope! VICTORY!

[kz1000ps]

LOL! The last four posts have been the best comments on this board EVAR!!!1!111

[DudeUrSistersHot]

I've finally discovered the ideal formula for an urban neighborhood. One with lots of green space, few shadows, no annoying college kids, nothing for NIMBYs to complain about. I propose that we take the wrecking ball to Boston and start over using my new designs.



City Squares:

http://www.ccc.de/camp/1999/field_4_big.jpeg



Residential:

http://whyfiles.org/200immigration_pop/images/mcmansion1.jpg



Offices:

http://www.boma-sv.org/images/awards/gateway-office-sm.jpg



Commercial/Retail:

http://readymademag.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2006/02/snowy%20ridge.jpg


I think that potentially, I have a winning design here that could revolutionize the American urban experience.

[statler]

8)
I like how there is none of that dangerous and costly public transportation. Nice job!

[PerfectHandle]

Dude's best post ever. Keep up the good work!

[palindrome]

what a metropolitan utopia! World class starchitechture!

[jass]

Needs more parking!

[kz1000ps]

I'm really, really sorry to show these to you guys...

Who ever knew beige could be so.. depressing.

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/4075/img4796om9.jpg

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/1701/img4797xw4.jpg

simply stunning
http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/5074/img4798fk5.jpg

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/4452/img4799wt6.jpg

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/6462/img4800ct3.jpg

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/5020/img4802cj8.jpg

yes, let's get farther away from this God-forsaken place

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/4165/img4804zh8.jpg

[statler]

How soon till we can start talking about tearing it all down and starting all over again?

[callahan]

The street lamps are nice. :)

[awood91]

i just kinda threw up in my mouth. but hey, now we have our very own share of Anycity, TX, USA

[Smuttynose]

I just don't get it. Portsmouth won't let you put up anything that's not pre-approved to appear in a Lifetime Channel Christmas Special. I'm not saying Boston needs that - but maybe slightly more aggressive planners - some windows, a few bricks, something other than this!

[Padre Mike]

:( How ironic if this is called the "Renaissance" seaport hotel. No rebirth here....reminds of of the fabulous Radisson (formerly Howard Johnson) in Park Sq, only less honest. At least the Radisson was built of concrete blocks that look like rough concrete. The seaport rendition wants us to believe that it is smoooooth concrete and thus more attractive. ugh!

[kmp1284]

If you people really care, why don't you bitch and moan in a more public forum such as the Globe's editorial page rather than some POS web forum which about 35 people read per day.

[palindrome]

:roll:

absolutely horrible. Seriously.

[vanshnookenraggen]

I honestly hope that one day, far into the future, people will look back at the seaport and hold it as an example of a totally post-modern architectural district. These buildings are boring now but I hope that when they are all done they will work together like the warehouses of SoHo or the townhouses of the Back Bay.

I would like this statement stricken from the record.

[tmac9wr]

I don't really have a big problem with precast...I think that used correctly, it looks good. At first I hated the Boston Harbor Residences (I think that's what they're called...the buildings to the right of the Hotel in the last couple pictures.), but now I think they're decent. I never had a problem with Precast--until now. This has got to be one of the worst buildings I've seen...Ever. Seriously, who ever thought that extreme beige would look better than glass??

Has there ever been a building that looked so different from its facade? Doesn't the original rendering look like it's covered in glass?

[briv]

If you people really care, why don't you bitch and moan in a more public forum such as the Globe's editorial page rather than some POS web forum which about 35 people read per day.

Your numbers are a bit off. Far more people read the posts here, including the worthless idiotic one you submitted, than you think.

[Waldorf]

That's terrible. How could this have happened to us. I thought everything had to have some sort of architectural merit in this city. I remember when the original version of the Hotel Commonwealth was built...everyone was up in arms. I'd take that over this any day.

[vanshnookenraggen]

People won't make a stink because this is so out of the way. The Hotel Comm. was such a debacle because it was in the heart of Kenmore Sq.

[tocoto]

IMO, the cheap finishes on this entire development are at least partly because few developers feel confident in making a profit in the area yet, and they do what they can to save money. Hopefully, the finishes will get better as the area is built out and developers believe their projects are more likely to be profitable.

There are lots of other reasons for the crummy finishes and architecture, like crazy planners, fanatical NIMBYs and cronies, but they are unlikely to change as the area builds out.

[singbat]

If you people really care, why don't you bitch and moan in a more public forum such as the Globe's editorial page rather than some POS web forum which about 35 people read per day.

Your numbers are a bit off. Far more people read the posts here, including the worthless idiotic one you submitted, than you think.


moreover, its not a numbers game based on just this site. the people on this forum and its predecessor almost certainly are the architecture and urban planning "opinion leaders" in their respective crowds. well thought out posts w/backup links, photos, materials, etc. probably have more impact then you think.

also, in the end, news outlets like the globe *may* give your letter a small slice of space once, but if a news outlet smells a grassroots political direction brewing they might at some point comment on it in a mainline story -- which is worth much more.

[ChunkyMonkey]

Looks like a vent building with windows. On the bright side, Manulife looks spectacular next to these monstrosities.

[vanshnookenraggen]

Looks like a vent building with windows. On the bright side, Manulife looks spectacular next to these monstrosities.

Maybe this is some high level architectural conspiracy to make the ManuLife building attractive?!

[TGSwimFly]

guys, once the trees fill in there will be nothing to worry about.

[Scott]

Yes this is terrible but the one they built down the road on Columbia Point is even worse with materials that seem to be purchased from Home Depot... seriously.

[lndscpr]

its just 1 bad building get over it. Some parts of it aren't that bad. conventioneers will love it. I don't see people refusing to stay here because it is ugly. Unless an architectural convention comes to town i don't see a problem.

[Padre Mike]

Still, it's fun to kvetch...where else can we find empathic listeners??

[chumbolly]

its just 1 bad building get over it. Some parts of it aren't that bad. conventioneers will love it. I don't see people refusing to stay here because it is ugly. Unless an architectural convention comes to town i don't see a problem.
The entire purpose of this board is to discuss and critique buildings in and around Boston. The point isn't whether people will refuse to stay in this blight, rather, it's that it looks like the East German Ministry of Planning, and it's a shame that such a boring building would be built in this location. I, for one, welcome complaints about this building.

[DudeUrSistersHot]

its just 1 bad building get over it. Some parts of it aren't that bad. conventioneers will love it. I don't see people refusing to stay here because it is ugly. Unless an architectural convention comes to town i don't see a problem.
The entire purpose of this board is to discuss and critique buildings in and around Boston. The point isn't whether people will refuse to stay in this blight, rather, it's that it looks like the East German Ministry of Planning, and it's a shame that such a boring building would be built in this location. I, for one, welcome complaints about this building.

Don't be so harsh...

There's no way the East German Ministry of Planning could have been this bad.

[Roxxma]

You're probably right about that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl-Marx-Allee)

[commuter guy]

Hi all,

This is my first post on the forum, but I have followed it for some time. It's a terrific resource. Regarding this building, I'll reserve final judgement until the final finishes are complete, but at this point, it appears this may very well be the most dreadful building to be constructed in Boston in recent memory.

Anybody know who had jurisdiction over design review, if any, for this building? Is it Massport land? Massport or BRA? What a shame that this type of schlock made the cut.

Menino wants to move city hall to the Waterfront, the new frontier. If business continues as is out on the far waterfront, the next mayor may very well be longing for the view of City Hall Plaza and the JFK building complex rather than these mistakes.

[atlantaden]

^^^
If I'm not mistaken, Joe Fallon developed the Renaissance Hotel and the Park Lane Apartments (on land leased from MassPort) next door. This is a scary thought but Joe Fallon is also developing Fan Pier!! I remember seeing the first renderings of Park Lane and the Hotel thinking, "hey, this looks pretty nice." Needless to say, the renderings and the actual product are much different. Fallon didn't even bother to cover up the rooftop AC equipment on a couple of the apartment buildings. He could have done so much more for buildings with such awesome views. More glass in all these buildings would have been so appropriate along with some color scheme variations. I hate to think what the final product on Fan Pier is gonna be.

[Bobby Digital]

I dont really get up in arms about the seaport like some people around here, but its definately not great. Its better than what used to be there, although i have alot of fond memories of the old seaport.

I was driving through on the way to the bar last night and saw one of them was lit up with blue lights, i like lights but this looks pretty weak. Didnt notice it before cuz i usually dont go that way at night theres just nothing down there at night.

BTW driving by/under the convention center is always sick.

[Java King]

Actually, an architecture convention is coming to Boston in May 2008.

AIA 2008 (American Institute of Architects)

25,000 to 30,000 architects will see the SPECTACULAR architecture and urban environment of this hotel. I'm sure they will be very impressed.

[kz1000ps]

Don't forget about the architectural marvel that is the Westin. I mean, just look at that streetfront interaction!

http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/8835/img4831xt0.jpg

[lndscpr]

Actually, an architecture convention is coming to Boston in May 2008.

AIA 2008 (American Institute of Architects)

25,000 to 30,000 architects will see the SPECTACULAR architecture and urban environment of this hotel. I'm sure they will be very impressed.


uhoh!

[jass]

I like the Westin.

And if whoever designed it liked it, and whoever funded it liked it, whos to say the architects wont?

[vanshnookenraggen]

http://static.flickr.com/51/114314494_de20e92bd4_o.jpg


The rendering is nicer.

Also, with regards to the Westin, that street wall is horrible BUT the entrance is well designed and relates very well to the convention center, which is where most people who was stying there will be going, so it works really well on one side and really horribly from the angle that picture is taken at.

[ablarc]

Where is Vivian Li to protect us from the likes of this?

http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/5074/img4798fk5.jpg

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/4452/img4799wt6.jpg

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/6462/img4800ct3.jpg

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/5020/img4802cj8.jpg

yes, let's get farther away from this God-forsaken place

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/4165/img4804zh8.jpg


The danger of mindless boosterism is that it leads its practitioners to heap praise upon such things. The conclusion precedes and invalidates the observation: it must be good, it's Boston!

[atlantaden]

Where is Vivian Li to protect us from the likes of this?


Better yet, where was Steve Bailey who just wrote that column bashing Russia Wharf.

[vanshnookenraggen]

All I can think of when I see those huge blank walls is this is perfect for graffiti.

[lexicon506]

^why not? Marriott should commission a giant mural dedicated to the seaport's past (or something like that) for those horrible blank walls. It would attract people to their building and break up the monotonous beige plague that is the seaport district.

Actually, I have a better idea. All of the forumers on archboston should meet up one night at the Renaissance and cover the walls with a beautiful image of what Boston's skyline should look like :D

[xec]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050211.jpg

Not much change here except for these. Maybe to attach a remnant of the second curtain wall shown in one of the early renderings?
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050214.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050238.jpg

At street level it makes the right gestures. The entire wall facing the park is glass the first two levels.
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050231.jpg

The transparency will make the activity inside visible from the park and vice versa. The park almost becomes an outdoor room extension of the hotel and you get a nice little public space in the making.
http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050229.jpg


http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050223.jpg


http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/0705050224.jpg

Overall the building itself isn't bad, even with the blank walls. What really kills it is the cheap precast paneling. Maybe when the Seaport is a little swankier it'll be reclad in higher quality materials.

[tmac9wr]

It looks like a totally new building with that new facade...I remember that being in the rendering and was wondering why it wasn't on the building when pics were posted here a couple weeks ago. Seems a little strange though, are they just sticking the glass to the precast? Also, how does it look from a distance? Any better than before?

[tocoto]

If you think this is bad, try visiting Crystal City in Arlington, VA just outside DC where I am now. An unbelievable collection of precast boxes, highway ramps and wasteland. It make this development look truly inspired . It's amazing to see the absolute crap going up all over the US.

[bosman]

Developers are constantly looking for cheaper ways to get a building up and make money. I think that there are fewer and fewer developers who really spend the time to make their projects look unique and interesting. My dad is always talking about new development (he's in the business) and some of the renderings that he brings home are truly bland and atrocious. He agrees with me, but he unfortunately can't do much about it since the companies design it and the he just gets hired to build it.

[kz1000ps]

Friday the 25th.. just like with the Archstone-Smith tower, I prefer the light blue insulation panels to the actual cladding

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/1507/img1783ih5.jpg

[ablarc]

just like with the Archstone-Smith tower, I prefer the light blue insulation panels to the actual cladding
Or it looks good just the way it is with its touch of blue. Why are architects afraid of a little color? Wait, don't tell me ... NIMBYs?

[Lurker]

http://sturman.livejournal.com/271320.html
http://sturman.ometro.net/journ/lj/2006/rzhd/rzhd_pan_b.jpg
http://sturman.ometro.net/journ/lj/2006/rzhd/rzhd_pan2_b.jpg

Eh, why not?

[vanshnookenraggen]

Those crazy Russians! I kind of like it. It works under the same principle that they used for camouflaging ships in WWI and WWII. The eye is distracted by the larger image and you can only see what it really is when you concentrate. Even then it is hard to make out.

I live across the street from projects like this (Peter Cooper Village and Sty Town if you care) and they would certainly look...different... if you did this to them.

[kennedy]

I might cry. That isn't actually the hotel, right (I'm not talking about the colorful Russian stuff)? They'll paint the precast, right? Some nice blues, with a lightish brownish greyish olive greenish? Or, maybe this is a joke. Maybe the walls are really made of wallpaper, and when they are done they'll rip it off to reveal something stunning, and inspired. Oh god, I hope so. Marriott/Renaissance usually have nicer buildings.

[czsz]

Actually the comparison to East Germany is quite apt. In the 1980s, the government there began experimenting with postmodernism, but their preference for precast concrete panels kept these buildings from matching their counterparts in the West. Some examples from Berlin:

Nikolaiviertel (attempt to rebuild a 17th century neighborhood) -

http://www.ststours.ca/cms_images/Nikolaiviertel.jpg

http://www.funkempfang.de/gerpics/staedte/berlin/c02070041nikolaiviertel.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/Berlin_Nikolaiviertel_Nussbaum.jpg/800px-Berlin_Nikolaiviertel_Nussbaum.jpg
(note the contrast here)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b5/Nikolaiviertel_2a.jpg/778px-Nikolaiviertel_2a.jpg


Apartments for high officials (the swankiest apartments in 80s East Germany):

http://www.perspektive89.com/system/files/images/Berlin-2005-Natal-9.preview.JPG

http://images.travelnow.com/hotels/BER_BRAN-exter-1.jpg

Actually, these may be better than the Renaissance. They have a smaller footprint, and have variegated forms...

[vanshnookenraggen]

Wow, those are actually really nice for concrete. It's the little design touches that turn it from an inhuman slab into a human-oriented livable building. Also the fact they they are not "towers in the park" help.

[Merper]

seaport is much, much worse than any of those... obtuse though they may be, i rather like them.

[kz1000ps]

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/4765/img3461ge9.jpg

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/8043/img3475kt7.jpg

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/4783/img3479mi5.jpg

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/1983/img3478rn9.jpg

[czsz]

You're right, vansnooken. If these facades in the Seaport were broken up creatively to half the extent of East German pomo buildings, they would feel infinitely more welcoming (and infinitely less monotonous). Large footprints don't have to suck if they're at least somewhat variegated. There have been few gestures toward that in this area.

[kz1000ps]

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/9388/img6542cl7.jpg

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/8849/img6573ut7.jpg

[KentXie]

The building is 'meh'

[kz1000ps]

* yawn *

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/4187/img9993zb0.jpg

In other news, the neglected sidewalk on the south side of WTC East (aka 2 Seaport Lane) is finally getting upgraded

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5112/img9991hl1.jpg

[kennedy]

I think a game of super vertical checkers is in order for the side of that building. I CALL THE PRECAST!

[xec]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissaceHotel_20071020_232S1.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071020_217.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071020_202.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071020_197.jpg

[awood91]

that just isn't a beautiful or impressive building by any stretch of the imagination. if i were to guess not knowing it was just done, i would have said that it was built in the early eighties.

[xec]

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071102_100.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071102_064.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071102_093.jpg

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r289/trixecol/RenaissanceHotel_20071102_076.jpg

[lexicon506]

All I can say is thank you for not showing my eyes the horror that is the back of that building.

[Corey]

Now I am curious about the backside.

[Mike]

Now I am curious about the backside.


It's further up the page.


Thanks for the updates, xec.

[Mike]

this is now completed and open:


http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/industries/retail/article/renaissance-boston-waterfront-hotel-opens_489567_7.html

http://www.marriott.com/hotels/travel/boswf-renaissance-boston-waterfront-hotel/

[czsz]

Did Fox Business News just print their press release?

[briv]

The $165 million hotel project is the next chapter in the fast-paced development story of the South Boston Waterfront's Seaport District.

Is this a typo, or did that heap of shit really cost $165 million?

[Padre Mike]

The picture on the Marriott site is deceiving; it makes this finished product actually look interesting. Too bad; another missed architectural opportunity. The Fox report tells us that the architect designed this building to recall "billowing sails" of ships coming into port????? The only thing billowing here is the boilerplate advertising and the contractors' pocketbooks!

[Lrfox]

Now these pictures are of Alexandria, Virginia right? I love this view when I'm flying into National. And Padre, you can't blame the Architect for the building not looking like it's "billowing." See by the time you've sailed through the Chesapeake Bay and are far enough up the Potomac, you're running on motor power, so I'm sure that was the intention of the design.

[tommym96]

blannnnnd

[palindrome]

Is this a typo, or did that heap of shit really cost $165 million?

somebody got ripped off.

[atlantaden]

I rode by a few weeks ago on the Silver Line and thought that the street level of the Marriot looked pretty good. Lots of glass, interesting front entrance, and I like the fact that a colonnade was built into it's base. Very bland building but looks like it'll have interesting blue night lighting. No HVAC showing on it's roof unlike it's even more unattractive neighbors, Joe Fallon's Parklane apartments that have their HVAC units showing for all the world to see. Such an awesome site for beautiful city/harbor views and such a disappointment in what was built. Were they blind to their very attractive neighbor, Manulife? The Marriott executive got suckered for the "billowing sails" line of crap, that's for sure and Joe Fallon just built cheap as someone mentioned in another thread? Makes we wonder about his Fan Pier.

[AC]

Very bland building but looks like it'll have interesting blue night lighting.
Yeah, it's not so bad at night, I kind of like it. I'm never going to have any use for the building and the exterior doesn't do me any favorers during the day (visually) but the inside sounds nice.

[BostonObserver]

Joe Fallon's Parklane apartments that have their HVAC units showing for all the world to see

Fallon is extremely connected and therfore held to a much lower standard.

Think Fan Pier!!!

[palindrome]

auction.

http://www.bizjournals.com/boston/real_estate/2011/08/renaissance-boston-headed-for-auction.html

[Fred R]

No 13th floor! That kind of nonsense should not be tolerated in the 21st century.

[datadyne007]

No 13th floor! That kind of nonsense should not be tolerated in the 21st century.

Most hotels and towers still do not have 13th floors. This should not be new news.

Btw, where is this comment even coming from?

[Sicilian]

Another take on the auction here (http://www.boston.com/yourtown/news/south_boston/2011/08/renaissance_waterfront_hotel_s.html).

[stellarfun]

Another take on the auction here (http://www.boston.com/yourtown/news/south_boston/2011/08/renaissance_waterfront_hotel_s.html).

Reading between the lines, it looks like a balloon note was due to be paid, and the mortgagee has yet to re-finance, or can't refinance the note. A smilar situation may await a developer who is a favorite of some forum members.

[Sicilian]

Does this trouble reflect a sudden market downturn, poor planning by its owner or both?

I ask because I wonder how the MCCA/BCEC can legitimately claim that taxpayers would be wise to finance a hotel, particularly one that would be only a block or two away from this failing one.

Maybe MCCA/BCEC could bid on this hotel at the auction and get on with it.

[datadyne007]

I'm a little confused on what this auction means. Will it stay a Renaissance by Marriott hotel?

[TheRifleman]

I ask because I wonder how the MCCA/BCEC can legitimately claim that taxpayers would be wise to finance a hotel, particularly one that would be only a block or two away from this failing one.

Maybe MCCA/BCEC could bid on this hotel at the auction and get on with it.

That's too much logic to think that way.

The Mayor needs the 300 million from the taxpayers because that is called job creation.........

Hook up your friends with FREE money........It's not like you will ever benefit from this situation.

[palindrome]

I'm a little confused on what this auction means. Will it stay a Renaissance by Marriott hotel?

most likely. Just under new ownership. There is always the potential or rebranding though if the property is failing.

[stellarfun]

most likely. Just under new ownership. There is always the potential or rebranding though if the property is failing.
The Globe news article indicated that "The Renaissance Boston Hotel is a performing asset, and we have been assured that this is about a financing structure that is unique to this hotel,” said Elsbree,"

If the property was a performing asset, that means there was enough revenue to pay interest and maybe a little bit of principal on a financing note, but NOT ENOUGH to cover a balloon payment. The previous news said the note had matured, meaning all the outstanding principal came due.

This is very similar, I am quite sure, to what Chiofaro will face come 2013 when his financing note comes due.

http://www.bizjournals.com/boston/stories/2008/07/07/daily18.html?t=email_story

[datadyne007]

It's too bad the exterior didn't get the same treatment that the interior did. The interior lobby spaces are gorgeous. No one ever talks about the interiors on this board... but it really is like entering another world. You enter this boring precast cookie-cutter building and then you're transported into this rich lobby experience. I feel like as a whole, architects are losing the interior/exterior relationship concept. The same happened with the Westin. Inside that place is freaking amazing, but the exterior is just bleh.

Also, thx for the clarification on the auction.

[Fred R]

To amplify a previous comment, written in haste. I recently had occasion to spend a night at the Renaissance. I agree that the lobby spaces and public areas are beautiful. And the rooms are well-designed and -furnished. I especially appreciated the lighting in my room; many hotel rooms have inadequate lights for reading. Of course, there is a 13th floor, but they call it 14. I find it quite annoying that some 21st century builders are clinging to mediaeval superstitions. btw, One Marina Park Drive, the subject of much criticism, has a floor 13.

[gooseberry]

I find it quite annoying that some 21st century builders are clinging to mediaeval superstitions. btw, One Marina Park Drive, the subject of much criticism, has a floor 13.
So? I don't get why someone would be annoyed by this.

[Sicilian]

No 21st century builders are clinging to medieval superstition.

I wouldn't be surprised if elevator companies just don't sell button panels with a #13 on them.

[SeamusMcFly]

Funny this bothers people. It's one of the quirky things that I really enjoy. Go to some casino high rises. You'll find out there are many more unlucky numbers, including an entire decade of numbers that may get skipped.

Or as Mitch Hedberg says.... My hotel doesn't have a 13th floor because of superstition, but come on man, people on the 14th floor, you know what floor you're really on. "What room are you in?" "1401" "No you're not! Jump out the window, you will die earlier!"

[datadyne007]

Hotels in Vegas skip the 40s because "4" in Mandarin sounds similar to "death."

Elevators have buttons that say 38-39-50-51...

And Sicilian, it doesn't work like that. All the panels are modular now (Dover was the pioneer of modular paneling with their Impulse line).

[datadyne007]

Also, I had this revelation on the #39 yesterday...

http://bostonluxuryresidential.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/110belvedere01.jpg

The Ren should have been more like The Belvedere. Their massing is pretty much the same.